theUpsideDown

Cheap? If we're so cheap why don't we get more flying? Just because you didn't pass an SSP interview doesn't mean you're torpedoed. If you're talking about something else, I doubt many on here are familiar.

Mesabah

I do believe some were torpedoed, but not for the reason of keeping 9E staffed. This is why I believe they are offering another chance for the double no's.

GuardPolice

I never mentioned you but would’ve done so if I thought you believed it.

I think you’re trying to paint me as the aggressor, at least I get that sense. I’ve actually been the defender of the DGI and Delta in all of this so I think the bell should be rung for other reasons.

GuardPolice

What other reasons are there?

Mesabah

The big reason, the same reason you don't allow a flow, goodwill.

Avroman

Those careers are only torpedoed if those pilots become too disheartened or lazy to apply elsewhere. Other airlines are hiring, apply. I kind of get it for us living in base where there's no other option but with the current bases we have, that doesn't apply as there is Sun Country for the MSP guys, Spirit for the DTW guys, and Southwest for the ATL guys. Just about everyone has a base in at least one of the New York airports so take your pick there.

Casualinterest

I want a flow here just as much as the next guy. And I think that we've shown through performance and professionalism (outliers not withstanding) that we represent Delta well.

That being said, I've talked to friends at PSA and Envoy that have told me about a part of the pilot group that does nothing to advance themselves professionally or personally because they know the flow will take care of them. Sit FO for years, work as little as possible, no volunteer work, no professional development or union involvement, etc.

I don't believe that's how it would be here, and I'm sure that's the minority those places, but it does raise and interesting problem with instituting a flow. How do you keep complacency and entitlement out of the pilot group? I'm intrigued by the program the union presented, using points to "earn" the "promotion". Sad to hear they weren't responsive to that either.

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Mesabah

If we had a flow, we would probably still be under the bankruptcy contract. They pay us now $30-$50K more a year not to have a flow. If we were going to get one, it would have already happened.

captkdobbs

There is a theory that many sociologists subscribe to known as the 2%-Rule (or some similar variant) which says that in ANY societal group, be it a profession, company, industry, etc., 2% of the members of that group cause the majority of problems within that group.

The '2%' is what will forever kill a flow to DL. There have only been a few bad apples in the various flow agreements to DL, but that small sampling has given the higher-ups in the hiring group enough ammunition to squash any (near-term) possibility of a flow.

The 'outliers' at 9e are the 2%, just as the guys you mention over at PSA and Envoy. It's unfair for the 98%, but in DL's hiring department, corporate memory is very durable.

Even the 'double nos' have a 2%. The other 98% stay professional and will remain so no matter what.

Flogger

I would say DL believes it's about a 33% percent bad apples, based on the hire rate.