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05-19-2018, 10:03 AM
#241
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,729
Originally Posted by uavking
Where did this guidance come from?
Last edited by havick206; 05-19-2018 at 10:33 AM.
05-19-2018, 11:43 AM
#242
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Position: FO
Posts: 793
Originally Posted by havick206
No guidance it’s just happening as per the contract. Those from the March bid getting withholding pay were sent HI6’s.
Reading the LOA again, does not say this. If it’s there point it out please.
05-19-2018, 12:00 PM
#243
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2018
Posts: 34
Originally Posted by in2deep
What’s your point? There are people at other companies doing the exact same job and getting treated much better. The only butthurt is coming from you. The industry has changed and Envoy needs to keep up. If you were in the same position has a new hire FO today, you’d feel the same. Sounds like youre jealous 
"The industry has changed". Now where have I heard that one before? Hint: Pinnacle.
By all means, let's fight for better pay and QOL. By all means, let's communicate frustrations regarding the lack of willingness to negotiate said improvements on the part of the company and/or AAG.
What gets intolerable is the incessant complaining (for complaining's sake) on the part of the new-hires directly to or in front of those here who have had it a hundred times worse. There will be no sympathy-- It's not "butthurt". It's an unwillingness to tolerate the whining. If you think things need to be improved, get involved with the process. Volunteer for a union position. LISTEN to those who are more experienced. ASK questions that will help improve all our lives. Appreciate what the PPs have been through, and they will appreciate that the current climate definitely calls for improvements in both the short and long term, for everyone on property.
As I've said before, no PP wants everyone to endure the same awful conditions as they've gone through. Improvements even at the new-hire level are still improvements and help the industry as a whole. But for god's sake, don't start the first conversation of a 4-day with a veteran CA you've never met by complaining about money, reserve, commuting, time to upgrade (it's too fast), etc.
We're glad the new guys are here, and more keep showing up. We just ask they extend the same courtesy to those who have endured everything from before and since the bankruptcy.
05-19-2018, 12:35 PM
#244
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,729
Originally Posted by SilentLurker
Reading the LOA again, does not say this. If it’s there point it out please.
The union are keeping track of those affected. Email your rep and the contract compliance committee to see where you sit in the queue for withholding.
05-19-2018, 01:11 PM
#245
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2016
Posts: 1,609
Originally Posted by llws
His/her point is that while there is absolutely nothing wrong that new-hire FOs have it way better than the PPs did during their first half decade here, the complaining and lack of appreciation for that position that said new-hire is in, comes off as an aggrandized form of entitlement.
"The industry has changed". Now where have I heard that one before? Hint: Pinnacle.
By all means, let's fight for better pay and QOL. By all means, let's communicate frustrations regarding the lack of willingness to negotiate said improvements on the part of the company and/or AAG.
What gets intolerable is the incessant complaining (for complaining's sake) on the part of the new-hires directly to or in front of those here who have had it a hundred times worse. There will be no sympathy-- It's not "butthurt". It's an unwillingness to tolerate the whining. If you think things need to be improved, get involved with the process. Volunteer for a union position. LISTEN to those who are more experienced. ASK questions that will help improve all our lives. Appreciate what the PPs have been through, and they will appreciate that the current climate definitely calls for improvements in both the short and long term, for everyone on property.
As I've said before, no PP wants everyone to endure the same awful conditions as they've gone through. Improvements even at the new-hire level are still improvements and help the industry as a whole. But for god's sake, don't start the first conversation of a 4-day with a veteran CA you've never met by complaining about money, reserve, commuting, time to upgrade (it's too fast), etc.
We're glad the new guys are here, and more keep showing up. We just ask they extend the same courtesy to those who have endured everything from before and since the bankruptcy.
"The industry has changed". Now where have I heard that one before? Hint: Pinnacle.
By all means, let's fight for better pay and QOL. By all means, let's communicate frustrations regarding the lack of willingness to negotiate said improvements on the part of the company and/or AAG.
What gets intolerable is the incessant complaining (for complaining's sake) on the part of the new-hires directly to or in front of those here who have had it a hundred times worse. There will be no sympathy-- It's not "butthurt". It's an unwillingness to tolerate the whining. If you think things need to be improved, get involved with the process. Volunteer for a union position. LISTEN to those who are more experienced. ASK questions that will help improve all our lives. Appreciate what the PPs have been through, and they will appreciate that the current climate definitely calls for improvements in both the short and long term, for everyone on property.
As I've said before, no PP wants everyone to endure the same awful conditions as they've gone through. Improvements even at the new-hire level are still improvements and help the industry as a whole. But for god's sake, don't start the first conversation of a 4-day with a veteran CA you've never met by complaining about money, reserve, commuting, time to upgrade (it's too fast), etc.
We're glad the new guys are here, and more keep showing up. We just ask they extend the same courtesy to those who have endured everything from before and since the bankruptcy.
Two rules should be followed by NH. Don't complain about your short sting on reserve. Don't complain that PP are sacrificing your QOL for flow because in reality those PP are directly responsible for the gains you received but they did not.
05-19-2018, 02:53 PM
#246
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2018
Posts: 34
Originally Posted by Pedro4President
The funny/sad thing is that pretty much EVERY single benefit has come to those hired after pilots hire in Spring 2016. ONE concession was forced upon them a limited number of those pilots and for a limited time. When I hear an FO complain about being on reserve for two months I don't know what to say. Do I give fake sympathy or just laugh. When I get an FO that's new that just got a composite or a hard line for the first time after being on reserve for a short time I am genuinely happy for them.
Two rules should be followed by NH. Don't complain about your short sting on reserve. Don't complain that PP are sacrificing your QOL for flow because in reality those PP are directly responsible for the gains you received but they did not.
Two rules should be followed by NH. Don't complain about your short sting on reserve. Don't complain that PP are sacrificing your QOL for flow because in reality those PP are directly responsible for the gains you received but they did not.
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