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Old 08-07-2015, 02:55 PM   #11  
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............. I'll definitely be reading sec 25 and all language regarding trip revisions, base replacement, substitution, etc with a skeptical and detailed eye. There is no loophole or loose language the company won't exploit.
I'd be very surprised to see sec 25 improvements that are more than token. IMHO, the company would rather win our love with a few extra beans than agree to things that can't be "interpreted" as they see fit. As such, conditional language, seen by us as a no cost fix, is a big deal to management. Its part of the control thing....
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Old 08-07-2015, 03:14 PM   #12  
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We're only down to pay, insurance and retirement.
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Old 08-07-2015, 06:15 PM   #13  
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$, $, and $.
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Old 08-07-2015, 11:04 PM   #14  
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The contract language is very important, but as long as we're short staffed things will always get ugly with any contract or management team as you will push up against the boundaries constantly compared to other times.
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Old 08-08-2015, 01:52 PM   #15  
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The contract language is very important, but as long as we're short staffed things will always get ugly with any contract or management team as you will push up against the boundaries constantly compared to other times.
You are 1/2 right. Now that schedulers/mgmt has stayed awake trying to find ways to solve the short staffing via holes in the contract, do not think that these techniques will "magically" evaporate when we get a new contract. These techniques by schedulers will certainly be remembered and they are the new normal. To think different is naive and short sighted.

As several other posters have accurately commented, management has boxed themselves into a corner (virtually no hiring in 7 yrs while easily 550 have retired, 767 simulators have been bungled, FAA 757/767 rulings have not gone in mgmts favor, labor relations have been deeply damaged). Mgmt has hatched an ugly duckling that will take years to turn into a pretty swan (assuming mgmt did everything right between now and then).
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Old 08-08-2015, 02:15 PM   #16  
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You are 1/2 right. Now that schedulers/mgmt has stayed awake trying to find ways to solve the short staffing via holes in the contract, do not think that these techniques will "magically" evaporate when we get a new contract. These techniques by schedulers will certainly be remembered and they are the new normal. To think different is naive and short sighted.

As several other posters have accurately commented, management has boxed themselves into a corner (virtually no hiring in 7 yrs while easily 550 have retired, 767 simulators have been bungled, FAA 757/767 rulings have not gone in mgmts favor, labor relations have been deeply damaged). Mgmt has hatched an ugly duckling that will take years to turn into a pretty swan (assuming mgmt did everything right between now and then).

Yep like accepted fares we will have to buy our schedules back in the next contract. Until then stay senior and avoid Memphis.
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Old 08-08-2015, 04:05 PM   #17  
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....Until then stay senior and avoid Memphis.
This. Being senior is good, avoiding the planet is better, getting bumped for training is best.
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Old 08-08-2015, 04:57 PM   #18  
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Yep like accepted fares we will have to buy our schedules back in the next contract. Until then stay senior and avoid Memphis.
Why should we wait until the next contract to buy our schedules back?

Can't we tell them to fix it in this contract or no deal?

I'd rather not get bent over for another 7 years.

Fix it now!
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Old 08-08-2015, 06:02 PM   #19  
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This. Being senior is good, avoiding the planet is better, getting bumped for training is best.
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Until then stay senior and avoid Memphis.
THIS. THIS. THIS. I struggled on the last MOAB with the upgrading decision and could hold Capt in all seats and domiciles except MEM777 CA (which I only missed by double digits). One thing that kept me back was the seniority that I enjoy that allows me to avoid the planet, bid carry-over and conflict it to protect days off, and dh'ing where possible and practical.

These new found scheduling tools will be the new normal for quite some time because there isn't a schoolhouse program currently in MEM that can churn out freshly trained operators -- and in the programs that can flush guys out (757, et al) there is then a backlog for IOE. It's not going to get better overnight and I expect arse-pain system-wide for the next year, maybe two, REGARDLESS of a ratified contract.

I really wanted to upgrade but am now glad that I kept my powder dry.
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Old 08-08-2015, 06:40 PM   #20  
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Why should we wait until the next contract to buy our schedules back?

Can't we tell them to fix it in this contract or no deal?

I'd rather not get bent over for another 7 years.

Fix it now!
I am with you, I'll vote no. Now all we need is another 2000 votes are so.
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