CFItillIdie

Hey all,

I am going to CSIP training here in a couple of weeks. Looks like it should be pretty fun. Anyone on here have any gouge on the training? I have the kit they make you purchase and it looks like a lot of good material. I guess I am just looking for any heads up on what to expect while I am up in Duluth.

I am pretty green to the Cirrus community so any advice would be appreciated! Thanks!

wmuchickenhawk

Have fun. I didn't go through the CSIP training but I did go through a course based on it using the same materials. The Familiarization worksheets should cover pretty much everything you need to know.

BoilerUP

Not a CSIP, but I do have a few hundred hours in and still regularly fly a SR22 G2.

<begin rant not necessarily directed at you>

I have no idea what they're teaching up in Duluth, but please don't be "that guy" Cirrus instructor who gives new high-net-worth Cirrus owners overconfidence in their airplanes' ability to handle weather & icing, and/or teaches them its okay to fill the tanks with 4 grown men onboard or cross the numbers on final at 85-90kts - because its not.

And yes, there are CSIPs out there that do that shiat.

<end rant>

I'd love to be a CSIP, but I cannot justify the outrageous cost of being blessed by CD to instruct in their airplanes.

Please do have fun and report back here what they teach!

Ewfflyer

I'm with Boiler, but I have an even more negative thoughts on the whole "CSIP" process. The plane is not that special IMO, but they did a good job convincing the insurance companies it is and then they can profit off of it.

CFItillIdie

I'll be honest the whole concept of having to be certified to be able to instruct in a single engine hp aircraft is beyond me...they sure did do a good job convincing the insurance companies that regular ol' CFI billy bob wasn't safe enough to teach in a CIRRUS!!!

I don't think I will be teaching people to hang out in ice...the AC my student is known ice, but we are smarter than that. As for full tanks and 4 people....who hasn't done that one before!?! Haha...I hope it will be a good way to really learn that G1000 even more than I already do. And maybe, just maybe it will be a nice addition to the ol' resume. I'll be sure to report back. I'm looking forward to a fun challenge...whatever they can throw at me.

CFItillIdie

This course is very proffesional. I am having great time and think that it's a valuable course in proffesional development as a cfi. I think it is taught in a way that will benefit anyone who attends.

Keith Stone

cirrus has the best marketing department available

crappy stall characteristics, so let's throw in aparachute!

i'm with the previous posters...HP engine, shouldn't require the "extra" training just to make cirrus some extra $.

per the regs, the TAA "endorsement" is a joke. if you can fly a HP aircraft, your homework is done

AtlCSIP

I guess I will chime in as the resident CSIP. I have about 1000 hours in Cirrus aircraft, including conventional six pack, avidyne, and perspective, as well as the turbo charged models. I have been a CSIP for about 4 years. Total time is about 2700, with about 1600 dual given.

The Cirrus is NOT your garden variety 4 place high performance aircraft. You can't learn the aircraft in 25 hours, yet you can become proficient enough to safely learn the aircraft, keeping within your personal minimums, of course, in a relatively short time frame. On average, it takes 10 to 12 hours for someone to feel comfortable enough in it to fly it without an instructor and not feel like they are holding on to the tail. I have over 800 hours dual given in them, so I think I have a pretty good handle on it. The fastest I have ever completed a transition with a student is 3.5 hours. This guy was an 11000 hour professional pilot with thousands of hours with Garmin avionics, and a very natural stick also. I have had students take over 25 hours. I have done primary training, transition training, instrument training, and CFII training in them.

Once you learn the systems, and assuming everything else is working, it is the best single engine, 4 place, single pilot IFR aircraft out there. It takes about 50 hours for most people to learn it well, and about 100 hours before you really feel like you are one with the plane, again averages here.

Because of all the different variations over the years, it takes a long time to learn all the different systems. The Avidyne system was actually the best system for most pilots as it was the most intuitive. The Perspective system has a lot of whiz bang stuff, but can confuse the average transitioning pilot more than is comfortable. It's great for the professional pilot, though.

For those who actually believe a Cirrus won't come out of a spin, I have been there, and it will. Idleize, neutralize, kick, push, pull. Comes right out, just like everyone else. Also had to demonstrate spins to get certified in Europe. Long story there, so I won't bore you with the details.

For the uninformed pilot who knows nothing about the stall characteristics of the Cirrus, the SR20 likes to break to the right, but is not unmanageable. The SR22, if you stay coordinated, is as docile as a PA28. You can hold full aft elevator, keep it coordinated, and it will just mush down. Really a non-event. I have done it for a couple of hundred feet. Again, I have been there. If you are having trouble with your 22, you either have a serious problem with your airframe and should have your mechanic look it over, or you don't know how to fly it.

For the guy going through the CSIP training, if you would like to talk about Cirrus training, PM me your contact info. I would be happy to help.

On a final note, I checked out in a Cirrus before I was ever an instructor. I focused on doing Cirrus training when I became an instructor. As such, I only have about 150 hours in Cessna 172's, and about 1000 in Cirrus, where I have been able to charge up to 65 per hour flying some of the best equipment in the GA fleet. It was one of the best decisions I made!

Comet

excuse my ignorance and somewhat thread jack
why does it take so long to get comfortable with it? Also, if someone were to buy a Cirrus (from Cirrus themselves), do they provide free training on it?

I only have around 5hours of flying under my belt total, and while I'm not proficient with the Cessna 172, I am comfortable..

Do other planes take so long to familiarize with?

Thanks in advance for your insight

BoilerUP

I checked out in our SR22 in 5 hours with a CSIP (insurance requirement), and hadn't flown a SE piston in nearly 2 years...though I was a professional pilot. When we had Avidyne R9 installed this past winter, it took me about 5 hours to become fully up to speed on it, though I was safe and capable of operating the airplane before bringing it home from the shop.

There's absolutely nothing special about flying a Cirrus, other than perhaps its less forgiving than other airframes about being too fast on final (reflected in the number of runway overruns it has).

And yeah, it does stall pretty benignly too...moreso than your average Cessna 150 IMO.