Originally Posted by Toonces

In the effort to not rehash this topic, here is the short summary.
PC-12 is a single pilot airplane.
Our part 91K and 135 operations require 2 pilots (SIC is loggable)
Our part 91 operations only require 1 pilot (SIC is not loggable; log PIC as sole manipulator)

Originally Posted by SonicFlyer

Makes sense, thank you.

A couple of questions:

- all of the ferrying flights are Part 91?

- How often are the flights at PS Part 91 as opposed to K/135?

- on a Part 91 flight only the FO or Cpt can log the time, correct?

Originally Posted by UnbeatenPath

All repo flights are 91

Only on empty legs

Both can log it. Captain is acting PIC so he logs it. You can log it as total time or sole manipulator

Originally Posted by JMO127

Most of this is on you. The times are what they are. Run the schedule and to hell with the turn times. People get themselves worked up over the dumbest things. Run the schedule or day your given. If you're late, you're late. That's on the FOC to explain and worry about, not you. You have to act like an adult and get food. You going without is your fault and your captains. Regardless of the turn times, you just do the best you can and be done with it. I also disagree about the retention rates. They are doing what they can and more changes on the horizon. As an F.O. I averaged 3k plus per check with the O.T. and I made nearly 65k first year. First year captain nearly 100k. There are plenty of opportunities as an IP that can add a TREMENDOUS amounts of $$ just as in anything you have to work for what you want in life. 6 days extra a month nets around 5k plus per diem. Add that to the base captain rate plus per diem equals 106 to 108k. Insurance is extremely good. It cost us around $800 to have our child. The main lacking here is the 401k match. Regionals are 6 majors top out depending on years of service around 12 or more depending on carriers. I have 25.2% rate of return on my investments as of the close of market today. I put 20% in per check. I don't do the company 401k. This is a fun job and you can make your day the best or miserable. It teaches you finesse and other things too. You'll be the same one after 4 months at the airlines complaining too. Same 6 airports each week and having to actually fly without the autopilot. Rotate positive rate gear up autopilot on. 100 above autopilot off powr and land. Upgrade in 2 years or 4 years doing the same thing. The odds of flying a heavy is slim to none. There are 20year guys still on the 88 or smaller. Never hold the holidays. I have a good friend with 25 plus at AA that still doesn't have seniority to hold Christmas. In fact this year he just will be able to hold. 24 years. He missed 24 Christmases and thanksgivings with his kids. Never saw them. It's not worth it for me. Travel is ok when you can get on the plane. No Positive space. The bonus is ok until year two you're back making 35 an hr. Yeah 75 guaranteed a month. Do the math. No thanks. Hell with the regionals. Stay here for 3k hours or more and go direct to the majors or atlas. Net jets.

Originally Posted by DarkSideMoon

Captain can't log it. The airlines would probably be fine with it but it isn't loggable in the eyes of the FAA. Show me anywhere where you can log PIC in a single pilot airplane under 91 without touching the controls.

Originally Posted by Toonces

Ahhh I love this discussion. Welcome to flying newbie.

FAR Part 1.1. As long as the captain is the designated PIC, he logs it.


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Originally Posted by UnbeatenPath

All repo flights are 91

Only on empty legs

Both can log it. Captain is acting PIC so he logs it. You can log it as total time or sole manipulator

Originally Posted by DarkSideMoon

If I designate myself captain of a 172 and my buddy flies it, can I log PIC?



you're a smart dude and I usually enjoy bantering with you. stand on the strength of your argument rather than attack someone else's experience.



1.1 covers who IS pilot in command, not who can LOG pilot in command. They're different.



You can only LOG pilot in command when you're sole manipulator of an airplane your rated in, sole occupant, OR acting as pilot in command in an aircraft that requires two pilots under the regulations in which it's operated.



https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...AND%20TIME.pdf

Originally Posted by Toonces

It is an interesting quandary. Our POI would disagree, and the document you posted sums it up nicely at the end.

“In summary, the person who is pilot-in-command may log PIC, others may also log PIC depending on the circumstances.”

I did a pretty exhaustive search of the FAA legal interpretations and couldn’t find an exact case that covers this. However, I think you would be hard pressed to find a FSDO that would not allow the PIC designated by a certificate holder to not log PIC if he is not physically manipulating the controls on a company assigned flight. (Apologies for the triple negative)

I read about a case of enforcement action involving two pilots in a King Air 200 and the logging vs acting of PIC, but I couldn’t find the actual document.


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