Frontier Negotiations Discussion
04-04-2018, 01:17 PM
#1321
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 550
Originally Posted by TurboFanMan
Why in God’s creation would we agree to LTD that isn’t own occupation?
04-04-2018, 02:18 PM
#1323
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,666
Originally Posted by madmax757
Can someone explain what "own occupation" means ? not to familiar.
With full, "own occupation" LTD, if you are unable to carry on your own occupation (pilot) because of the disability then you will receive the full benefits without regard to your capability of performing another job with your disability.
04-04-2018, 03:38 PM
#1325
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Position: CRJ-200 CA
Posts: 434
Originally Posted by Aero1900
The pilot group does not want PBS. If we are forced to accept PBS, it will have to come with much higher pay rates. We are in a better position than Spirit was, therefore I expect a better contract.
Spirit pilots were slapped with a TRO, while Frontier management has been found by a neutral arbitrator to be negotiating in bad faith. In addition, we still have the LOA 67 issue. This puts us on better footing than Spirit pilots and I expect a better deal.
As far as PBS goes, I think the union will not accept a TA with it. I would be surprised if PBS makes it through the process. If it does, the pay rates will have to be quite a bit higher than Spirits. I expect to keep line bidding and pay rates slightly higher than Spirits.
Spirit pilots were slapped with a TRO, while Frontier management has been found by a neutral arbitrator to be negotiating in bad faith. In addition, we still have the LOA 67 issue. This puts us on better footing than Spirit pilots and I expect a better deal.
As far as PBS goes, I think the union will not accept a TA with it. I would be surprised if PBS makes it through the process. If it does, the pay rates will have to be quite a bit higher than Spirits. I expect to keep line bidding and pay rates slightly higher than Spirits.
And one of the most alarming things the company proposed was a 5 year duration... that’s another 8-9 year contract... if I’m saying yes to 5 years, the entire contract has to be iron clad and guaranteed... and there has to be a clause that we’ll have a new contract the day the 5 years is up... so basically, 5 years is a hell to the no from me
04-04-2018, 04:40 PM
#1327
On Reserve
Joined APC: May 2016
Posts: 12
Originally Posted by Xdashdriver
The way our current LTD is worded, after two years of being on LTD they can re-evaluate your case and if they deem you are capable of doing a job other than being a pilot with your disability, they can/will reduce your benefits.
With full, "own occupation" LTD, if you are unable to carry on your own occupation (pilot) because of the disability then you will receive the full benefits without regard to your capability of performing another job with your disability.
With full, "own occupation" LTD, if you are unable to carry on your own occupation (pilot) because of the disability then you will receive the full benefits without regard to your capability of performing another job with your disability.
I'm not sure why the previous poster said we would have to pay tax on the 8K max when we don't on the 5K current max. I'm not aware of any change in that direction. We pay tax on the imputed income from the LTD premiums, therefore we don't have to pay tax should we collect benefits. At least that was my understanding. That would seriously impact the extra 3K per month max if we had to pay tax on it.
Own occupation to age 65 is the only way to be ensured of getting the benefit. Right now the Company can change the policy carrier and terms of the policy without our input. I personally don't trust them with that much latitude. I assume they will shop for the cheapest carrier that will offer the minimum benefit required by the Contract. If all we have is 8K max a month, that leaves them too much room to add loopholes to allow termination of benefits, thereby lowering costs. And we all know lowering costs is a passion around here...
04-05-2018, 07:32 AM
#1328
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2010
Posts: 66
Originally Posted by TruthAddict1
According to the Unum policy, which has recently changed to another carrier whose terms have yet to be released, there was a two year limit on mental health and substance abuse. The other loophole was, if it was determined that you could make at least eighty percent of your benefit at another job you were qualified for, they could terminate your benefit. I don't know how much proof they had to come up with, if any, that you could actually find a job paying that amount. I also don't know how often they used that language to kick people off LTD. But I do know insurance companies don't make money by paying out when they can avoid doing so.
I'm not sure why the previous poster said we would have to pay tax on the 8K max when we don't on the 5K current max. I'm not aware of any change in that direction. We pay tax on the imputed income from the LTD premiums, therefore we don't have to pay tax should we collect benefits. At least that was my understanding. That would seriously impact the extra 3K per month max if we had to pay tax on it.
Own occupation to age 65 is the only way to be ensured of getting the benefit. Right now the Company can change the policy carrier and terms of the policy without our input. I personally don't trust them with that much latitude. I assume they will shop for the cheapest carrier that will offer the minimum benefit required by the Contract. If all we have is 8K max a month, that leaves them too much room to add loopholes to allow termination of benefits, thereby lowering costs. And we all know lowering costs is a passion around here...
I'm not sure why the previous poster said we would have to pay tax on the 8K max when we don't on the 5K current max. I'm not aware of any change in that direction. We pay tax on the imputed income from the LTD premiums, therefore we don't have to pay tax should we collect benefits. At least that was my understanding. That would seriously impact the extra 3K per month max if we had to pay tax on it.
Own occupation to age 65 is the only way to be ensured of getting the benefit. Right now the Company can change the policy carrier and terms of the policy without our input. I personally don't trust them with that much latitude. I assume they will shop for the cheapest carrier that will offer the minimum benefit required by the Contract. If all we have is 8K max a month, that leaves them too much room to add loopholes to allow termination of benefits, thereby lowering costs. And we all know lowering costs is a passion around here...
If your employer pays the LTD premium (even if you have imputed income on said premium), the benefits are taxed as ordinary income and treated as such. If the employee pays premium with after tax dollars the benefits are not taxed.
04-05-2018, 08:22 AM
#1329
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 550
Originally Posted by Bluesky1
If your employer pays the LTD premium (even if you have imputed income on said premium), the benefits are taxed as ordinary income and treated as such. If the employee pays premium with after tax dollars the benefits are not taxed.
04-05-2018, 09:19 AM
#1330
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,093
Right now the company pays 90% of the premium and taxes you on that 90% (making the benefit tax free). 10% is the alpa assessment on your pay stub. I believe the ta language takes the benefit from 5 to 8 grand, company pays 100% and the structure remains (tax free). There wasn’t enough info in the blast mail to know for sure and in my opinion there’s no point in asking till I see a complete ta.
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