Originally Posted by OregonAviator

What is your issue with Horizon? You type this like this is factual info you have which it isn't. You guys don't make more than we do with our 52 Q's with your 15 jets, keep spreading rumors dude we all know it's the game face alaska plays with Horizon and you, regional affiliate Skywest to keep us all in line.

Originally Posted by snackysmores

We don't really know how much Horizon makes per year because all of our money goes directly to Alaska, they shuffle money back and forth between the two companies constantly and will absolutely never disclose any financial movement or spreadsheet data.

Having said that, Alaska says our 2016 profit was 23.5m, with a profit margin of 5.5 percent. While this is down 14% from last year (due to bad management), our profit margin is still unbeatable in the regional industry.

While you say no one is interested in a Q400 operation, the Alaska BOD disagrees with you. The Q400s suck but make Alaska a sh!tload of money compared to what they'd be bringing in with an RJ. They aren't going away any time soon (unfortunately).

With the way Alaska management operates, if they figured out a way to make money using Skywest on all of our routes we would have been dissolved years ago when you first took our RJs. Theres two reasons this has not happened, 1: They can't. and 2: They would never give Skywest that kind of leverage over Air Group. Alaska whipsaws Horizon and Skywest against each other to keep costs down. If we disappeared Skywest could effectively set whatever rates they wanted because no one else could do the flying. Not gonna happen.


The SAN/BOI announcement is really going to hurt Qx recruitment though. The company can truly no longer say "People come to Horizon for the exclusive PNW bases!" Uhh hello, Skywest has pretty much all the same bases as us now, and they have jets...The only way Alaska can secure itself is to give Horizon pilots true flow, but that won't happen as long as Tilden is CEO.

Originally Posted by Jonneaux

Can you read? The information that I posted is right out of the Alaska year end financials, which I linked. Unless you are accusing AAG of fraud in their financial filings, those are the facts.

Originally Posted by Jonneaux

I appreciate the thoughtful response, as usual. A few issues though; SkyWest's costs were about 20% lower than Horizon's on the CRJ so Alaska would hardly need Horizon to whipsaw with. You state that the Q400 makes a lot of money for Alaska, the numbers from the fincial statements don't bear that out. If you are suggesting that AAG is manipulating the numbers in their financial filings, that would constitute fraud. Where are you getting your information on Horizon's profitability?

Originally Posted by AKNGPilot

Hello all, and thanks in advance.

What are current upgrade times looking like for previous 121 folks?

Originally Posted by casey135

I don't think anyone had been bypassed yet, it's still about 2 1/2 years so most have the 1000hrs or mil/121 mix required by then.

Originally Posted by casey135

I don't think anyone had been bypassed yet, it's still about 2 1/2 years so most have the 1000hrs or mil/121 mix required by then.