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Scope

Old 06-26-2018, 11:36 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by Bozo the pilot View Post
So instead of flying B6 metal, they would codeshare it out and get 1% of the fare instead of the full amount?
Why?
Not snark, serious question.
Because they are making money. They wouldn’t have the overhead to make money. If you had to take all the risk and have the really high overhead and hope people buy tickets on your flight or get a guaranteed amount of money with someone else’s overhead what would you do? Heck if it was my decision I’d take my 1 dollar and not risk any then put all my work and sometimes make 10
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:41 AM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by Bozo the pilot View Post
So instead of flying B6 metal, they would codeshare it out and get 1% of the fare instead of the full amount?
Why?
Not snark, serious question.
For the same reason all airlines farm out flying. They collect profits and put downward pressure on labor. Under our scope we could code share with two A320 operators on our routes and whipsaw them.

Still a yes vote Bozo? Please explain.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:43 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by hilltopflyer View Post
Because they are making money. They wouldn’t have the overhead to make money. If you had to take all the risk and have the really high overhead and hope people buy tickets on your flight or get a guaranteed amount of money with someone else’s overhead what would you do? Heck if it was my decision I’d take my 1 dollar and not risk any then put all my work and sometimes make 10
So then you do not believe that B6 will go to Europe or have any ability or desire to do so?
Great- argue that, because to suggest that Robyn will get ETOPS and have the ability to do it himself and THEN choose to codeshare is ridiculous. Or it makes sense to you and you share BDs misinterpretation of codesharing.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:46 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by PasserOGas View Post
For the same reason all airlines farm out flying. They collect profits and put downward pressure on labor. Under our scope we could code share with two A320 operators on our routes and whipsaw them.

Still a yes vote Bozo? Please explain.
Farming out in a fee for departure and codesharing are different things.
Again guys, codesharing is not a windfall for the company and many of you are conflating the two. Educate yourselves on Codeshare vs. Fee for departure.
Passer- tell me you know the difference...
And prove you do
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:47 AM
  #15  
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Not to interupt the yelling and screaming, but has anyone submitted these questions to ALPA?

Would like to hear the answer during a road show.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:55 AM
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ALPA is answering the submitted questions.


http://jbumec.alpa.org/Home/TA2018/tabid/11287/Default.aspx


Please have a look.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by seekingblue View Post
ALPA is answering the submitted questions.


http://jbumec.alpa.org/Home/TA2018/tabid/11287/Default.aspx


Please have a look.
Cool, thanks I’ll check it out.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:59 AM
  #18  
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From the FAQ on B6 Alpa:



Can JetBlue use an operator such as JetSuite to provide feed under a Capacity Purchase Agreement?
No, agreed upon language prevents the Company from doing this. The Company is prohibited from entering into any Capacity Purchase Agreements or purchase Block Space on other carriers, and they cannot not purchase equity in, or lend to, another company that is an air carrier or an affiliate of an air carrier as a means to circumvent the provisions of our Scope agreement. Other provisions in scope prohibit JetBlue for using an entity like JetSuites as an alter ego or for doublebreasting.

Can JetBlue operate a JetBlue Express / regional carrier?
JetBlue cannot enter into a Capacity Purchase Agreement with any other carrier. However, if JetBlue were to establish a new brand, i.e. JetBlue Express with regional jets, it would be flown by JetBlue Pilots under the same CBA and seniority list.


Seems fairly clear cut to me, no?
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Old 06-26-2018, 12:01 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by seekingblue View Post
From the FAQ on B6 Alpa:



Can JetBlue use an operator such as JetSuite to provide feed under a Capacity Purchase Agreement?
No, agreed upon language prevents the Company from doing this. The Company is prohibited from entering into any Capacity Purchase Agreements or purchase Block Space on other carriers, and they cannot not purchase equity in, or lend to, another company that is an air carrier or an affiliate of an air carrier as a means to circumvent the provisions of our Scope agreement. Other provisions in scope prohibit JetBlue for using an entity like JetSuites as an alter ego or for doublebreasting.

Can JetBlue operate a JetBlue Express / regional carrier?
JetBlue cannot enter into a Capacity Purchase Agreement with any other carrier. However, if JetBlue were to establish a new brand, i.e. JetBlue Express with regional jets, it would be flown by JetBlue Pilots under the same CBA and seniority list.


Seems fairly clear cut to me, no?
It is but guys are conflating codesharing and fee for departure.
2 totally different things.
Codesharing is necessary.
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Old 06-26-2018, 12:10 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by PasserOGas View Post
So many guys on here are leaning yes or voting yes primarily because of the scope provisions in the TA. Scope=job. After reading through the TA I think the complete lack of protections in that section need to be discussed. As I read it, the company can outsource every single flight at Jetblue with 2 limits.


1. The outsourced flying cannot be flown on a plane labeled "Jetblue".


2. The airline must fly 3% more block hours in the year it is signed.


That is pretty much it. We can outsource literally EVERY. SINGLE. FLIGHT.


There appears to be ZERO limits on the number of 50 seat aircraft the company can codeshare on. NONE. They just can't be called jetblue express.


Wow. That is some airtight language fellas. Lets get that signed into law! I feel so secure in my job with that insurance policy.



Why are you guys even THINKING about voting yes to this?



*Edit* Wow, copy/pasting the scope provision isn't as easy as I thought.
How can we trust you? We don’t even know your name? What’s makes you so smart. Let me guess you know what is best for all of us and our families?

Let’s start with....what is your name?
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