ULCC or American?
02-15-2020, 08:21 AM
#101
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 541
[QUOT(they don't have the competitive advantage of Discount Airline Pilot wages, but market forces are addressing that to a degree).[/QUOTE]
Hmmm, aren’t legacy salaries subsidized by thousands of regional pilots? For years they were the ultimate discount pilot. Maybe you have more of a competitive advantage than you realize.
Hmmm, aren’t legacy salaries subsidized by thousands of regional pilots? For years they were the ultimate discount pilot. Maybe you have more of a competitive advantage than you realize.
02-20-2020, 04:57 AM
#102
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,091
Originally Posted by SFA320
Hmmm, aren’t legacy salaries subsidized by thousands of regional pilots? For years they were the ultimate discount pilot. Maybe you have more of a competitive advantage than you realize.
As an example, FAs at my company make $70/hr top scale (and there are a ton at top scale) where as at my regional they topped out around $40 and there were maybe a half dozen at that rate. Same goes for ground crew, here it's $35/hr IIRC and at the contractors they start at $13 and top out around $17 IIRC.
Meanwhile pilots on the 50 seaters make around $80/hr and our 737/A320 guys make around $270. So not a huge disparity in how the salary scales on a per pax basis.
02-20-2020, 07:51 AM
#103
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Position: 175 CA
Posts: 1,285
Originally Posted by Name User
Pilots are mostly paid by the aircraft size so the labor savings isn't as significant as the labor saved on paying all the other personnel such as ground workers, FAs, gate agents, etc.
As an example, FAs at my company make $70/hr top scale (and there are a ton at top scale) where as at my regional they topped out around $40 and there were maybe a half dozen at that rate. Same goes for ground crew, here it's $35/hr IIRC and at the contractors they start at $13 and top out around $17 IIRC.
Meanwhile pilots on the 50 seaters make around $80/hr and our 737/A320 guys make around $270. So not a huge disparity in how the salary scales on a per pax basis.
As an example, FAs at my company make $70/hr top scale (and there are a ton at top scale) where as at my regional they topped out around $40 and there were maybe a half dozen at that rate. Same goes for ground crew, here it's $35/hr IIRC and at the contractors they start at $13 and top out around $17 IIRC.
Meanwhile pilots on the 50 seaters make around $80/hr and our 737/A320 guys make around $270. So not a huge disparity in how the salary scales on a per pax basis.
First year CA pay on the A319 (128 seats): $255/hour = $2 per seat
First year CA pay on the E175 (76 seats): $76/hour = $1 per seat
Run that "Proportionate" math by me one more time. It gets even more ridiculous if you compare FO seats and higher productivity of regional pilots.
Regional pilot subsidize mainline pilot wages. It's a Ponzi scheme.
02-20-2020, 10:40 AM
#105
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,091
Originally Posted by Varsity
Probably one of the most inaccurate arguments I have ever heard, and it's surprising how much mainline pilots blindly believe it. The disparity is often more than 100%.
First year CA pay on the A319 (128 seats): $255/hour = $2 per seat
First year CA pay on the E175 (76 seats): $76/hour = $1 per seat
Run that "Proportionate" math by me one more time. It gets even more ridiculous if you compare FO seats and higher productivity of regional pilots.
Regional pilot subsidize mainline pilot wages. It's a Ponzi scheme.
First year CA pay on the A319 (128 seats): $255/hour = $2 per seat
First year CA pay on the E175 (76 seats): $76/hour = $1 per seat
Run that "Proportionate" math by me one more time. It gets even more ridiculous if you compare FO seats and higher productivity of regional pilots.
Regional pilot subsidize mainline pilot wages. It's a Ponzi scheme.
If you want I could use our 777/787 pay but that would actually skew in my favor. I chose the mid level numbers instead of picking and choosing to make my own point.
02-20-2020, 11:06 AM
#106
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 531
Originally Posted by Name User
What was inaccurate about my numbers?
If you want I could use our 777/787 pay but that would actually skew in my favor. I chose the mid level numbers instead of picking and choosing to make my own point.
If you want I could use our 777/787 pay but that would actually skew in my favor. I chose the mid level numbers instead of picking and choosing to make my own point.
02-21-2020, 11:56 AM
#107
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 541
Originally Posted by watch
12 year CA pay between the 737 and 175 is off by about 15% favoring mainline. That's it.
02-21-2020, 01:20 PM
#109
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 531
Originally Posted by SFA320
If you are only factoring in straight pay the yes. But benefits, profit sharing, and 401k DC aren’t even close to the same at the regional level.
"Regional pilots do the same exact job as mainline and get paid less. They subsidize mainline. It's a Ponzi scheme."
It's hard to take seriously guys making $100k+ with four weeks vacation complaining that they are underpaid. Also, go to mainline if you think you deserve more, this is literally the hottest hiring market in part 121 ever.
Are they in their unions negotiating committee? If not I give zero craps.
Everyone is a victim nowadays.
02-21-2020, 02:34 PM
#110
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: guppy CA
Posts: 5,152
Originally Posted by Varsity
Probably one of the most inaccurate arguments I have ever heard, and it's surprising how much mainline pilots blindly believe it. The disparity is often more than 100%.
First year CA pay on the A319 (128 seats): $255/hour = $2 per seat
First year CA pay on the E175 (76 seats): $76/hour = $1 per seat
Run that "Proportionate" math by me one more time. It gets even more ridiculous if you compare FO seats and higher productivity of regional pilots.
Regional pilot subsidize mainline pilot wages. It's a Ponzi scheme.
First year CA pay on the A319 (128 seats): $255/hour = $2 per seat
First year CA pay on the E175 (76 seats): $76/hour = $1 per seat
Run that "Proportionate" math by me one more time. It gets even more ridiculous if you compare FO seats and higher productivity of regional pilots.
Regional pilot subsidize mainline pilot wages. It's a Ponzi scheme.
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