The AirTran Pilots' Windfall and SLI

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01-03-2011, 06:29 PM

#141

Gomerglideslope

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Posts: 335

[QUOTE=SteelHorseFlyer;

The last 9 years of hiring during AirTran's almost tripling in size means that 2/3 of the pilots hired were hired with extensive PIC experience, spotless records, and can-do attitudes that WILL blend well with the Southwest culture. [/QUOTE]

Yes, quite....but what to do with that other 1/3?

01-03-2011, 09:15 PM

#142

80ktsClamp

Da Hudge

Joined APC: Oct 2006

Position: Poodle Whisperer

Posts: 17,473

Quote:

Originally Posted by cencal83406

Wow... USAir 2.0 in the making. Pay rates and work rules should have no bearing on career expectations. Same equipment... hope the arbitrator fairly integrates y'all.

Payrates and workrules SHOULD have some bearing, but the that is by no means the end all be all..

01-03-2011, 09:32 PM

#143

FAULTPUSH

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp

Payrates and workrules SHOULD have some bearing, but the that is by no means the end all be all..

Payrates and workrules change, seniority is forever. Payrates and workrules are very ephemeral, and not much of a basis for career expectations.

01-03-2011, 09:41 PM

#144

1Seat 1Engine

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Posts: 1,385

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAULTPUSH

Payrates and workrules change, seniority is forever. Payrates and workrules are very ephemeral, and not much of a basis for career expectations.

From the first Post in this thread:

"Simply stated, the rates of pay, rules and working conditions in the Chautauqua Pilots' collective bargaining agreement, are far superior to those found in the Shuttle America Pilots' collective bargaining agreement. As a result of the acquisition Shuttle America Pilots will be the beneficiaries of the superior rates of pay, rules and working conditions found in the Chautauqua Pilots collective bargaining agreement."

"A date of hire seniority integration, while it might not significantly dilute the seniority of the Chautauqua Pilots, would, to some extent, constitute a WINDFALL BENEFIT for the Shuttle America Pilots."

So at least one arbitrator thought differently.

l'm no lawyer, but it seems pretty clear.

01-03-2011, 10:30 PM

#145

80ktsClamp

Da Hudge

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Posts: 17,473

Both of your biases will be proved ultimately wrong. Relative seniority will have significant bearing, but workrules/contract (career expectations) will also come into play to a lesser extent.

Enjoy your merged sandbox.

01-03-2011, 11:06 PM

#146

Boogie Nights

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Position: KC135 IP

Posts: 398

Whoa Whoa Whoa

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrionTanker

Anything can happen if both sides agree. For example, SWA contract states a two year fence. But it could be less or more if agreed by both sides.

Every acquisition is not the same. This one is going to work since AirTran long time ago based their culture from SWA.

Will it work? Time will tell.

Boy I missed that one. If AT has SWA culture it is only because the pilot group has done a professional job, not beacause anything AT did.
AT supposedly the best management in the industry.
SWA has the best leadership in the industry.
You manage things, and lead people.
Trust me AT as a company has a lot to learn from SWA.
I personally would welcome some more leadership in the industry.

01-03-2011, 11:13 PM

#147

Boogie Nights

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Posts: 398

Eric hoffer

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrionTanker

Smokey, look back at the start of ValuJet and you will see that the business model was based on SWA and Delta. The culture was based on SWA. No arguments please, I was at ValuJet for several years.

Now you look at AirTran and there was a transformation to what it is today. Management put a huge knife in the back of the culture. The AirTran acquisition is still going to work. I will say this again, AirTran and its culture are the best fit with SWA. No other airline comes a close second.

Have a great year.

Please read the book "The True Believer"
I believe you believe what you are saying, but wow, you are way out in left field in the rain with fans pelting you with peanut shells.
In other words "I respectfully disagree "

01-03-2011, 11:16 PM

#148

Boogie Nights

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Posts: 398

Here Ya GO

Quote:

Originally Posted by WHACKMASTER

AirTran employees as a whole will indeed fit in well with SWA employees because we will appreciate the culture the most! In fact, I think we'll flourish quite well. After you get beaten down for so many years, you tend to really appreciate it when you're finally treated like a damned human being. May our management team get tangled and suffocated in their golden parachutes. A-holes.

Preach it from the mountain tops.
This is a proper perspective!

01-03-2011, 11:32 PM

#149

Boogie Nights

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Position: KC135 IP

Posts: 398

Come On Now!!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by jetpilot4u

Aloha,

As a partaker in many cockpit discussions about this subject.... I'm also sorry to say that you're right. If the Air Tran guys get greedy.... our culture will be shot.

"SWA Culture" is no big deal if it can't survive this. SWA has a group of 1700 guys who want nothing more than to do a good job, contribute to the greater good, and be rewarded for hard work.

Yes a few will gripe on both sides but really we all just want to (as they say at KATL) "Keep it moving"

If SWA culture can't survive a few whiners on both sides then it was no big deal to begin with.

Honestly I believe SWA's culture could survive a lot more than a merger with Airtran. In fact you might be surprised at the enthusiam boost SWA might get from freashly motivated group of pilots.