Delta getting close to fleet renewal order
07-01-2011 | 07:09 AM
#41
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Joined: Feb 2010
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From: The New Delta
Very interesting gloopy and George.
And it'll be interesting to see the 321 rates. 757 replacement should be 757 pay, no?
But I think as to pathetic A320 rates, something also needs to be done about paying 88 pilots $10 less for flying an airplane seating 149 passengers or the same number of passengers as the 320 and 20 seats more than the 319. At least the 160 seat 90 is only $5 less.
It's about time to combine airplanes together, 130-160 seaters as one?
And it'll be interesting to see the 321 rates. 757 replacement should be 757 pay, no?
But I think as to pathetic A320 rates, something also needs to be done about paying 88 pilots $10 less for flying an airplane seating 149 passengers or the same number of passengers as the 320 and 20 seats more than the 319. At least the 160 seat 90 is only $5 less.
It's about time to combine airplanes together, 130-160 seaters as one?
Last edited by johnso29; 07-01-2011 at 07:27 AM.
07-01-2011 | 07:09 AM
#42
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,724
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From: Boeing Hearing and Ergonomics Lab Rat, Night Shift
Very interesting gloopy and George.
And it'll be interesting to see the 321 rates. 757 replacement should be 757 pay, no?
But I think as to pathetic A320 rates, something also needs to be done about paying 88 pilots $10 less for flying an airplane seating 149 passengers or the same number of passengers as the 320 and 20 seats more than the 319. At least the 160 seat 90 is only $5 less.
It's about time to combine airplanes together, 130-160 seaters as one?
And it'll be interesting to see the 321 rates. 757 replacement should be 757 pay, no?
But I think as to pathetic A320 rates, something also needs to be done about paying 88 pilots $10 less for flying an airplane seating 149 passengers or the same number of passengers as the 320 and 20 seats more than the 319. At least the 160 seat 90 is only $5 less.
It's about time to combine airplanes together, 130-160 seaters as one?
BTW we will never see the C-Series...
It's just too expensive for what it does.
At about 22M (with the 50% discount) the C-Series is way to capital intensive per seat to fit with the fleet plan.
Used MD90s are running about 10M all-in with the mods for 160 seats. Why would Delta buy airplanes that are twice as expensive and carry fewer people. With fewer seats all the fuel efficiencies of the new technology fuselage and GTF are soaked up.
The real 120 seater DC-9 replacement is already in service and is available for a discount in the used markets, it's called a 717...
With a first class we can make it work, without first, I'm afraid its way to costly/seat for a "discount" carrier...
Oh, and the airline with the flower on the tail just got 3 more 717 from Boeing.
FWIW Boeing has already stated they will not bid on our RFP...
Cheers
George
Last edited by georgetg; 07-01-2011 at 07:17 AM. Reason: fixed it for the speeling police...you know who you are ;-)
07-01-2011 | 07:09 AM
#43
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Joined: Jun 2006
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From: A-320A
07-01-2011 | 07:12 AM
#44
Happy to be here
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: A-320A
Amen!
BTW we will never see the C-Series...
It's just too expensive for what it does.
At about 22M (with the 50% discount) the C-Series is way to capital intensive per seat to fit with the fleet plan.
Used MD90s are running about 10M all in with the mods for 160 seats. Why would Delta buy airplanes that are twice as expensive and carry fewer people. With fewer seats all the fuel efficiencies of the new technology fuselage and GTF are soaked up.
The real 120 seater DC-9 replacement is already in service and is available for a discount in the used markets, it's called a 717...
With a first class we can make it work, without firts I'm afraid its way to costly/seat for a "discount" carrier...
Oh, and the airline with the flower on the tail just got 3 more 717 from Boeing.
FWIW Boeing has already stated they will not bid on our RFP...
Cheers
George
BTW we will never see the C-Series...
It's just too expensive for what it does.
At about 22M (with the 50% discount) the C-Series is way to capital intensive per seat to fit with the fleet plan.
Used MD90s are running about 10M all in with the mods for 160 seats. Why would Delta buy airplanes that are twice as expensive and carry fewer people. With fewer seats all the fuel efficiencies of the new technology fuselage and GTF are soaked up.
The real 120 seater DC-9 replacement is already in service and is available for a discount in the used markets, it's called a 717...
With a first class we can make it work, without firts I'm afraid its way to costly/seat for a "discount" carrier...
Oh, and the airline with the flower on the tail just got 3 more 717 from Boeing.
FWIW Boeing has already stated they will not bid on our RFP...
Cheers
George
07-01-2011 | 07:14 AM
#45
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
I would love to see this happen. We just need to be careful to build rock solid language into the contract about CERTIFIED seats. Republic has this in their contract, however; management has shrewdly pulled 1 seat out of the 190's to make it a 99 seat jet, thus paying the pilots the lower rate to fly the same plane.
It's a bit of making sausage in public though. Amen!
BTW we will never see the C-Series...
It's just too expensive for what it does.
At about 22M (with the 50% discount) the C-Series is way to capital intensive per seat to fit with the fleet plan.
Used MD90s are running about 10M all in with the mods for 160 seats. Why would Delta buy airplanes that are twice as expensive and carry fewer people. With fewer seats all the fuel efficiencies of the new technology fuselage and GTF are soaked up.
The real 120 seater DC-9 replacement is already in service and is available for a discount in the used markets, it's called a 717...
With a first class we can make it work, without firts I'm afraid its way to costly/seat for a "discount" carrier...
Oh, and the airline with the flower on the tail just got 3 more 717 from Boeing.
FWIW Boeing has already stated they will not bid on our RFP...
Cheers
George
BTW we will never see the C-Series...
It's just too expensive for what it does.
At about 22M (with the 50% discount) the C-Series is way to capital intensive per seat to fit with the fleet plan.
Used MD90s are running about 10M all in with the mods for 160 seats. Why would Delta buy airplanes that are twice as expensive and carry fewer people. With fewer seats all the fuel efficiencies of the new technology fuselage and GTF are soaked up.
The real 120 seater DC-9 replacement is already in service and is available for a discount in the used markets, it's called a 717...
With a first class we can make it work, without firts I'm afraid its way to costly/seat for a "discount" carrier...
Oh, and the airline with the flower on the tail just got 3 more 717 from Boeing.
FWIW Boeing has already stated they will not bid on our RFP...
Cheers
George
Maybe SWA/DAL have a deal in the works for 2013? Not to offend an AAI guys, I think if that was the case by that time most on the 717 will transition right over to the 737 and the F word would never be mentioned.
But if DAL wants DC9 replacements then really the only legitimate replacement is a DC9. Not the 318. Nobody wants it. And 737-700 seems like a lot of bang for the buck but it's a lot of bucks it seems for the bang, if that makes any sense.
Let me clarify all this banging for bucks, it's a hell of a 137 seat jet, can do a lot, great for some of our Latin American flying and such, but it's probably right now a lot of money for a 137 seater, no?
07-01-2011 | 07:14 AM
#46
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Joined: Jul 2006
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From: Boeing Hearing and Ergonomics Lab Rat, Night Shift
I would love to see this happen. We just need to be careful to build rock solid language into the contract about CERTIFIED seats. Republic has this in their contract, however; management has shrewdly pulled 1 seat out of the 190's to make it a 99 seat jet, thus paying the pilots the lower rate to fly the same plane.
Certified seats is the key along with a max certified MTOW.
Our Section 1 needs to have better language about what will happen when things go wrong and a set schedule for reviewing and fixing any scope violations. That language in 76-seat scope section about removing the seats is a good example of how to spell out the remedies...
Cheers
George
07-01-2011 | 07:35 AM
#47
Moderator
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,088
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From: B757/767
07-01-2011 | 07:37 AM
#48
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,088
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From: B757/767
I doubt it would even make it to MEMRAT. It definitely won't make it past MEMRAT. Is NOT going to happen.
07-01-2011 | 07:52 AM
#49
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,201
Likes: 32
From: 4A2FU
I'm guessing you guys are just baiting an old guy like me, but it's Daltrey and Townsend...Get it right!
Never understood why my mom didn't like me singing along to "Squeeze Box."
I'm holding out for the 757Neo/NG. Boeing could be making a killing if they had thought of that 2 years ago.
Never understood why my mom didn't like me singing along to "Squeeze Box."I'm holding out for the 757Neo/NG. Boeing could be making a killing if they had thought of that 2 years ago.
They need to create a carbon 757 body and throw a 787 wing/engine on it and it would be perfect.
07-01-2011 | 07:58 AM
#50
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,088
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From: B757/767
Boeing shutting down the 757 line was just one of the many poor decisions they've made over the last 7 years that will continue to hurt them. A stretched 737 cannot and will never replace a 757. Sad.
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