Shortage or Just Hiring Wave- Analysis
06-05-2012, 05:31 PM
#61
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 466
Originally Posted by thrust
This.
There are going to be A LOT of folks fleeing active duty USAF over the next 5-10 years. It will be interesting to see if the majors give preference to military guys, as they have in the past.
There are going to be A LOT of folks fleeing active duty USAF over the next 5-10 years. It will be interesting to see if the majors give preference to military guys, as they have in the past.
Preference to UAV drivers!
06-05-2012, 08:38 PM
#62
7.27%
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: Boeing
Posts: 543
Originally Posted by thrust
This.
There are going to be A LOT of folks fleeing active duty USAF over the next 5-10 years. It will be interesting to see if the majors give preference to military guys, as they have in the past.
There are going to be A LOT of folks fleeing active duty USAF over the next 5-10 years. It will be interesting to see if the majors give preference to military guys, as they have in the past.
PtP
06-07-2012, 05:30 AM
#63
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 70
I'm trying to put together some profiles for the international airlines, particularly those that hire a lot of ex-pats (Ethihad, Qatar, Emirates, etc). However information is more scarce on these airlines.
If anybody knows the size of the pilot list at any of these airlines that would help me build them into the model. Also I have some of the delivery information but more would always be helpful.
If you can link your sources that would be helpful to, but if not we can see if we can get a consensus on the data online. Thanks
If anybody knows the size of the pilot list at any of these airlines that would help me build them into the model. Also I have some of the delivery information but more would always be helpful.
If you can link your sources that would be helpful to, but if not we can see if we can get a consensus on the data online. Thanks
06-09-2012, 11:55 AM
#64
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 70
Okdokey, for those who were interested and asking for international numbers, the best I could do was Emirates.
Since I don't have an accurate number of Pilots on the list at Etihad or Qatar, I could have applied the same pilot/aircraft ratio from Emirates to these airlines, but didn't feel it would have been accurate enough.
Interestingly, the number of Pilots to Aircraft is higher than Delta's, I have to assume that is from their high number of International flights, and one of the highest aircraft utilization rates in the world (I read at close to 18 hours per day on each aircraft)
Since I don't have an accurate number of Pilots on the list at Etihad or Qatar, I could have applied the same pilot/aircraft ratio from Emirates to these airlines, but didn't feel it would have been accurate enough.
Interestingly, the number of Pilots to Aircraft is higher than Delta's, I have to assume that is from their high number of International flights, and one of the highest aircraft utilization rates in the world (I read at close to 18 hours per day on each aircraft)
06-09-2012, 12:29 PM
#65
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Window seat
Posts: 5,211
Originally Posted by PilotAnalyst
Okdokey, for those who were interested and asking for international numbers, the best I could do was Emirates.
Since I don't have an accurate number of Pilots on the list at Etihad or Qatar, I could have applied the same pilot/aircraft ratio from Emirates to these airlines, but didn't feel it would have been accurate enough.
Interestingly, the number of Pilots to Aircraft is higher than Delta's, I have to assume that is from their high number of International flights, and one of the highest aircraft utilization rates in the world (I read at close to 18 hours per day on each aircraft)
Since I don't have an accurate number of Pilots on the list at Etihad or Qatar, I could have applied the same pilot/aircraft ratio from Emirates to these airlines, but didn't feel it would have been accurate enough.
Interestingly, the number of Pilots to Aircraft is higher than Delta's, I have to assume that is from their high number of International flights, and one of the highest aircraft utilization rates in the world (I read at close to 18 hours per day on each aircraft)
Emirates is only w/b a/c, with a fair amount of long haul flying.
The higher percentage of long haul flying will impact the number of pilots per a/c.
10-12-2022, 05:31 AM
#66
On Reserve
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 16
Originally Posted by PilotAnalyst
I ran some hiring numbers and thought this might be interesting Data, since it seems like were always talking about pilot hiring demand, but don't ever seem to see any real numbers to show what is happening from a larger perspective. I figured since we know what an airline aircraft order schedule looks like, and what aircraft are suppose to be replaced by that order with their fleet retirement schedule, we can reasonably project the size of an airlines fleet for the next few years. I assumed after 2020 we would see stagnant fleet sizes( just to be on the safe side in projecting pilot demand- since few orders extend beyond that year).
With this model we can project their pilot demand by multiplying the number of aircraft in their fleet by their current pilot to aircraft ratio. (For Example An Airline that has 3100 pilots and about 315 aircraft- so it takes about 10 pilots to run each aircraft) If this Airline were to grow by 1 airplane they would need 10 more pilots.
On top of their growth/shrinkage pilot requirements we can add their mandatory pilot retirements which are also fairly public knowledge. So we can add the number of pilots they need from growth each year to the number of pilots that are projected to retire to get an idea of how many pilots will be needed from that airline year after year.
Lots of things are variable (like aircraft order schedules, exercising aircraft options, pilots retiring early, pilot productivity rules, etc) so this model is a snapshot of current hiring projection from a conservative viewpoint. I put this data on my website since I didn't know how to put the graphs and tables onto this forum. I'll post additional airlines and clean up the format as I have time. Just remember these are just estimates, but I thought the calculated guess's were interesting.
Because its a conservative HR projection model over the next 10-20 years we can get a better idea of how long it will take to get to 50% seniority for upgrade for those who get hired in the next few years at the majors, based upon current aircraft orders/retirements and pilot retirements.
The most interesting thing I found in all of this was that for the next 5 to 10 years most regional FO's can expect to be in the right seat for at least 5 years, even during the most intense hiring in the next 6 years. Just because the Regional pool is so much larger compared to the Mainline pilot demand than it was 30 years ago on the front side of this wave. So we will see only 10% a year from the Regional's go to the majors. That's still 5 year upgrades.
United Airlines Projection-
United Airlines Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Delta Airlines Projection-
Delta Airlines Pilot Hiring | Audries Aircraft Analysis
American Airlines Projection-
American Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
US Airways Projection-
US Airways Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
JetBlue Airways Projection-
JetBlue Airways Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Alaska Airlines Projection-
Alaska Airlines Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Comparison and Totals-
Airline Pilot Demand Comparison | Audries Aircraft Analysis
With this model we can project their pilot demand by multiplying the number of aircraft in their fleet by their current pilot to aircraft ratio. (For Example An Airline that has 3100 pilots and about 315 aircraft- so it takes about 10 pilots to run each aircraft) If this Airline were to grow by 1 airplane they would need 10 more pilots.
On top of their growth/shrinkage pilot requirements we can add their mandatory pilot retirements which are also fairly public knowledge. So we can add the number of pilots they need from growth each year to the number of pilots that are projected to retire to get an idea of how many pilots will be needed from that airline year after year.
Lots of things are variable (like aircraft order schedules, exercising aircraft options, pilots retiring early, pilot productivity rules, etc) so this model is a snapshot of current hiring projection from a conservative viewpoint. I put this data on my website since I didn't know how to put the graphs and tables onto this forum. I'll post additional airlines and clean up the format as I have time. Just remember these are just estimates, but I thought the calculated guess's were interesting.
Because its a conservative HR projection model over the next 10-20 years we can get a better idea of how long it will take to get to 50% seniority for upgrade for those who get hired in the next few years at the majors, based upon current aircraft orders/retirements and pilot retirements.
The most interesting thing I found in all of this was that for the next 5 to 10 years most regional FO's can expect to be in the right seat for at least 5 years, even during the most intense hiring in the next 6 years. Just because the Regional pool is so much larger compared to the Mainline pilot demand than it was 30 years ago on the front side of this wave. So we will see only 10% a year from the Regional's go to the majors. That's still 5 year upgrades.
United Airlines Projection-
United Airlines Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Delta Airlines Projection-
Delta Airlines Pilot Hiring | Audries Aircraft Analysis
American Airlines Projection-
American Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
US Airways Projection-
US Airways Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
JetBlue Airways Projection-
JetBlue Airways Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Alaska Airlines Projection-
Alaska Airlines Pilot Demand | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Comparison and Totals-
Airline Pilot Demand Comparison | Audries Aircraft Analysis
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
