DAL & NWA Pilots To Take Contract to Management on May 29th
05-30-2008, 08:10 AM
#42
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
IMHO -
Mesa's injunction gives a strong indication of the merits of their case.
Injunctions are hard to get because the Court is acting BEFORE the trial. If the Court is willing to stop action preemptively that is a very strong indication that it believes that position will prevail.
I'm not sure if the Contracts with Mesa and Republic are bankruptcy proof, but I'm thinking the bankruptcy tool might get pulled out of the tool box again (for a variety of reasons) but mostly to deal with around 4 to 5 billion dollars worth of DCI contracts. The tail is wagging the dog.
IMHO this puts pressure on Comair (the RJ's that can be parked) and DC9's (the other, other, RJ's that can be parked).
Mesa's injunction gives a strong indication of the merits of their case.
Injunctions are hard to get because the Court is acting BEFORE the trial. If the Court is willing to stop action preemptively that is a very strong indication that it believes that position will prevail.
I'm not sure if the Contracts with Mesa and Republic are bankruptcy proof, but I'm thinking the bankruptcy tool might get pulled out of the tool box again (for a variety of reasons) but mostly to deal with around 4 to 5 billion dollars worth of DCI contracts. The tail is wagging the dog.
IMHO this puts pressure on Comair (the RJ's that can be parked) and DC9's (the other, other, RJ's that can be parked).
05-30-2008, 08:12 AM
#43
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Originally Posted by Superpilot92
It was sarcasm on my part reread what i wrote(above post ^^^^), not to mention the "
". I was doing just as you suggest, i was calling out his "rumor".
". I was doing just as you suggest, i was calling out his "rumor".Sorry, my bad
05-30-2008, 08:16 AM
#44
Underboob King
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Guppy Commander
Posts: 4,412
^^^tsquare-No problem, i am with you. One Company One Contract^^^^^
We got the same type of info. Stated they agreed to meet for 3 days in late June to hopefully finish it up. We shall see.
Originally Posted by Deez340
Just got an email from DALPA saying the meeting referenced here was not to present a completed joint contract but rather to agree on a three party frame-work for negotiating said agreement. Oh well.
05-30-2008, 09:54 AM
#45
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
Originally Posted by Deez340
You keep making his point. The "flexibility" of which you speak means they're easier and therefore more likely to get parked. If you don't understand that then I can't help you either.
That being said, I spoke with one of the higher ups (name changed to protect the innocent) the other day and he candidly said that while the 30's were to go by by in short order the 50's would very likely have a future as a stop gap measure in the 100 seat market as a gap exists and
they don't like any of the new product available in that seat range. (ERJ and such) He went on to say that in this environment any fleet plan would not only need a date stamp but a time stamp to be reliable, as it may change two or three times in any given day.
That being said, I spoke with one of the higher ups (name changed to protect the innocent) the other day and he candidly said that while the 30's were to go by by in short order the 50's would very likely have a future as a stop gap measure in the 100 seat market as a gap exists and
they don't like any of the new product available in that seat range. (ERJ and such) He went on to say that in this environment any fleet plan would not only need a date stamp but a time stamp to be reliable, as it may change two or three times in any given day.
The -50's have 125 seats.
The -40's have 110 seats.
05-30-2008, 09:57 AM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
Originally Posted by tsquare
I dunno... seems to me that the injunction only prevents immediate CH 7 of Mesa, whereas NOT granting it is a death sentence. I don't think it is any indication of case merit, much less an indication of a strong position. Seems that it gives the lawyers a few more weeks to wring a few more million, and the so-called judges to review the case. JMHO though...
05-30-2008, 10:12 AM
#47
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,273
Originally Posted by Superpilot92
thats funny i just heard a rumor from a FAA MX inspector that DAL was parking all their 22 year old 767s. Heard that on the NWA FA board, Again its just a rumor....
I don't know what you consider a rumor. You had 160 DC-9's 3 years ago. How many do you have today? How many did you have in Dec. How many will you have next Dec. Here is a article that is a little dated. A further reduction of 8 more nines was put out after this.
Northwest speeds up DC-9 reduction
var yahooBuzzArticleId = 'usatoday:http://blogs.usatoday.com/sky/2008/01/nwa-dc9.html?csp=34';yahooBuzzArticleIdBuzz up!
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Northwest plans to ground one quarter of its DC-9 jets this year as part of a fleet downsizing. But, despite the reductions, the airline says the move will not result in the loss of pilots' jobs. The Minneapolis Star Tribune (free registration) writes NWA said "it expects to increase the use of the remaining planes in its fleet and hire 200 to 250 pilots by the year's end." Airline spokesman Roman Blahoski tells the paper extra flying with other aircraft in the NWA fleet "is projected to more than offset the reduction in required DC-9 staffing."
By the end of the year, NWA expects to have 68 DC-9s in its fleet, down from the current 92. The airline had already planned to eliminate some DC-9s this year, but the new projection accelerates that effort. "Everybody is evaluating fleet in the face of current oil prices," William Swelbar, a research engineer at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and author of the blog Swelbar on Airlines, tells the Star Tribune. The Memphis Business Journal (free registration) adds NWA's "fleet of DC-9s, which had interiors remodeled in the 1990s, average about 35 years old and are less fuel efficient than newer models. As oil prices climb, the carrier is hoping to save some money by grounding them."
05-30-2008, 10:45 AM
#50
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
Originally Posted by sailingfun
I don't know what you consider a rumor. You had 160 DC-9's 3 years ago. How many do you have today? How many did you have in Dec. How many will you have next Dec. Here is a article that is a little dated. A further reduction of 8 more nines was put out after this.
Northwest speeds up DC-9 reduction
var yahooBuzzArticleId = 'usatoday:http://blogs.usatoday.com/sky/2008/01/nwa-dc9.html?csp=34';yahooBuzzArticleIdBuzz up!
Like this story? Share it with Yahoo! Buzz
Northwest plans to ground one quarter of its DC-9 jets this year as part of a fleet downsizing. But, despite the reductions, the airline says the move will not result in the loss of pilots' jobs. The Minneapolis Star Tribune (free registration) writes NWA said "it expects to increase the use of the remaining planes in its fleet and hire 200 to 250 pilots by the year's end." Airline spokesman Roman Blahoski tells the paper extra flying with other aircraft in the NWA fleet "is projected to more than offset the reduction in required DC-9 staffing."
By the end of the year, NWA expects to have 68 DC-9s in its fleet, down from the current 92. The airline had already planned to eliminate some DC-9s this year, but the new projection accelerates that effort. "Everybody is evaluating fleet in the face of current oil prices," William Swelbar, a research engineer at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and author of the blog Swelbar on Airlines, tells the Star Tribune. The Memphis Business Journal (free registration) adds NWA's "fleet of DC-9s, which had interiors remodeled in the 1990s, average about 35 years old and are less fuel efficient than newer models. As oil prices climb, the carrier is hoping to save some money by grounding them."
Northwest speeds up DC-9 reduction
var yahooBuzzArticleId = 'usatoday:http://blogs.usatoday.com/sky/2008/01/nwa-dc9.html?csp=34';yahooBuzzArticleIdBuzz up!
Like this story? Share it with Yahoo! Buzz
Northwest plans to ground one quarter of its DC-9 jets this year as part of a fleet downsizing. But, despite the reductions, the airline says the move will not result in the loss of pilots' jobs. The Minneapolis Star Tribune (free registration) writes NWA said "it expects to increase the use of the remaining planes in its fleet and hire 200 to 250 pilots by the year's end." Airline spokesman Roman Blahoski tells the paper extra flying with other aircraft in the NWA fleet "is projected to more than offset the reduction in required DC-9 staffing."
By the end of the year, NWA expects to have 68 DC-9s in its fleet, down from the current 92. The airline had already planned to eliminate some DC-9s this year, but the new projection accelerates that effort. "Everybody is evaluating fleet in the face of current oil prices," William Swelbar, a research engineer at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and author of the blog Swelbar on Airlines, tells the Star Tribune. The Memphis Business Journal (free registration) adds NWA's "fleet of DC-9s, which had interiors remodeled in the 1990s, average about 35 years old and are less fuel efficient than newer models. As oil prices climb, the carrier is hoping to save some money by grounding them."
Sailing,
Even though there has been no SLI yet, "you" is quickly becoming "we." Those 100 seat aircraft are something that is unique to the Legacy Carriers right now - (Except US Airways EMB-195's). If we were smart, we would be trying to keep them.
How many DC-9 would NWA have next year? I can't say for sure, but I doubt if they would park them all. This may sound funny, but people do have to get from Traverse City and Minot to the hubs you know and they pay big bucks to do it. No matter how much you like the MD-88 or the 737, I doubt that it make sense to take those airplanes into places like that.
The argument to keep the -9s is that there is no real replacement out there for them except the EMB-195. Is it cheaper to keep the -9s or buy a brand new multi million dollar aircraft? I'll let the bean counters make that determination. But, whatever they decide, we as a union should do whatever it takes to keep that flying for the mainline carriers.
I guess what I'm saying is that you should not assume that NWA is planning on parking all of the DC-9s. If they do, they will have to replace them. Which is good for all of us.
New K Now
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