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Mesa Airlines Regional Airline

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Old 03-31-2013, 03:24 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by sulkair View Post
Yep, skillett - I'm the same age, and in the same exact boat. Downgrade, two small children. Point about Micky D's well taken, and I agree. This sucks bad and I feel stuck!

But... If I'm honest... Out of a new-hire class of well over 30, myself and only one other pilot are still at Mesa. Half dozen of them are now at Southwest. Half dozen at Virgin. Another half dozen at Jet Blue, I think one got on at Alaska. The rest are at Emirates, Atlas, you name it.

Point is I have no-one to blame but myself and I know it. Should have flown more, (not always bid CML reserve) should have knocked out that degree in the hotel rooms (at least you got that under your belt), should have upgraded earlier, should have been an instructor, check airman. Should have shook more hands, made more friends, and on and on.

What will become of us guys who are too old to start over yet still young enough to hope for a shot at a good airline job? Don't know but I'm as discouraged as you are trust me.

It'll get better next year right?
I had a huge nice comment but the internet kicked me off, argh. In short version. Thanks for the nice comment, I'm getting a headache from posting bad things and it's not my style. Great people here at Mesa, training department, chief pilots and pilots. A few of the flight attendants are questionable though, hehe. Come to Mesa but if you are feeling abused get out. I was a captain for five years and did not want to make a lateral move. I was playing the waiting game but I'm done waiting. Corporate, Allegiant, Virgin or Emirates, I don't care, it's time to go. I hit 40 last week and it's time to make some money. Mesa has become a better place to work but is ran by ingorant narcissistic douchebags and there orders are sent via crewtrac and scheduling. It's the same thing going on with all of corporate america but that is another post rant. Anyway, weather is great, surf is up and my lady is looking sexy today. Happy Easter!

Last edited by skillett; 03-31-2013 at 03:29 PM. Reason: misspell
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Old 04-03-2013, 09:38 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by skillett View Post
And by the way, you can make 36,000 a year at Mcdonalds. live in Hawaii, get done with work and grab your board and hit the waves as well. Like you said, Mesa is what you make it. And at 40, my wife, kids, friends and family are all reaping the benfits of my incredible success.
If you like working 5+ days per week, with no vacation in sight, cleaning Micky-scags kitchen, getting clowned by drunks, and grabbing your board for an 8pm surf, then yea, those jobs are comparable. Now if you like working 18 days/month, flying around beautiful HI, and going anywhere in the world on your days off, then you might wanna be a little more realistic. Yes 36k sucks, but nobody ever sat there on their death bed saying "I wish I woulda made more money". Besides, you are one lucky break away from making 6 figures. No disrespect, I understand, but I just wanted to remind ya it ain't too bad. A Mesa/Hawaii 36k still puts you in the worldwide 1% as far as standard of living in my opinion.
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Old 04-03-2013, 12:53 PM
  #23  
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Bottom line for any interested...do your homework!! I have worked at Mesa for around 9 years now, I am a downgrade, and yet I still feel as though Mesa has brought me from a CFI to give me all the professional requirements I have. All of my friends that have gone other places have said that MAG has a GREAT training program, and the airline is really further along than other regionals. EFB's, nine new airplanes by July, and PBS (Preferential Bidding) are all bonuses that don't happen at other places. Line guarantee (no matter what happens, you will get paid at least what you are awarded at the beginning of the month, regardless of what cancels). Is it the greatest place to be...maybe not, but it sure does have some decent qualities.
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Old 04-03-2013, 02:13 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by GearMover View Post
YEP SCREW scheduling is horrible but I don't know of any place that has scheduling that calls and says "hey we had someone call out and would like it for you to show up to take the flight but if you don't want to don't worry about it you just do what you want and we'll work around what works best for you"
Every mainline carrier does EXACTLY that if you're not on reserve. Among the regionals, though, I doubt you'd hear it that often, agreed.

Originally Posted by sulkair View Post
What will become of us guys who are too old to start over yet still young enough to hope for a shot at a good airline job? Don't know but I'm as discouraged as you are trust me.
You probably have your 1000 TPIC by now, right? If so, I'm not sure why you think its a 'lateral move' or 'starting over' to go to a mainline carrier. Most all of them pay the same, or better, than Mesa FO (what you are now), and you'll have just about as many days off, if not more. Second year income is almost as good as Mesa CA pay at some places, and the rest of them you'll be back to Mesa CA pay by year 3-4, and break even on the whole think by year 5-6 (make back all your losses). You'll have pretty good control of your schedule (due to superior work rules), and even though you may not get Christmas off the first year or two, you'll have much better overall QOL, since you'll have more days off, more time with your family, and less stress while you're working too.

Originally Posted by Polo View Post
EFB's, nine new airplanes by July, and PBS (Preferential Bidding) are all bonuses that don't happen at other places. . . . Is it the greatest place to be...maybe not, but it sure does have some decent qualities.
PBS is a concession - plain and simple. Name one mainline carrier that got PBS out of bankruptcy. There's a reason that Fed Ex, UPS, Southwest, etc all don't have PBS, and Delta, United, and AA now do. PBS is not a plus, unless you're in the top 10% of your bid category.

EFB's are nice, but I'd rather carry my own charts if it meant I could pocket $10K more (at another regional). The 9 new airplanes - that's good though. While all regionals are in for a rough ride, Mesa does have a good fleet mix and financials to survive the hard times that are likely on the horizon in the regional industry for the next decade.

Of course, most every other carrier can do the same move Mesa did to get in such a 'plum' position: shed all your 50 seaters, all your bad debt, and start over - but keep the same clowns running the show. The race to the bottom continues. Ahh . . . the wonders of bankruptcy in the airline industry.
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Old 04-03-2013, 03:04 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by sulkair View Post
What will become of us guys who are too old to start over yet still young enough to hope for a shot at a good airline job?
Sniper, No, you're absolutely correct. I was referring to being too old to jump into another career field entirely. I'm absolutely hoping to do exactly what you speak of.

I'm just sitting around doing nothing, waiting for the pilot shortage to start (total sarcasm in-case you missed it) Well about the pilot shortage anyway, cause I don't believe in it. The sitting around doing nothing, no, that is entirely true. Well except for my side gig. BugAlien- Best Bug Catcher Ever! Snapping Jaws, Powerful Magnification
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Old 04-03-2013, 04:18 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by PurpleCRJ View Post
If you like working 5+ days per week, with no vacation in sight, cleaning Micky-scags kitchen, getting clowned by drunks, and grabbing your board for an 8pm surf, then yea, those jobs are comparable. Now if you like working 18 days/month, flying around beautiful HI, and going anywhere in the world on your days off, then you might wanna be a little more realistic. Yes 36k sucks, but nobody ever sat there on their death bed saying "I wish I woulda made more money". Besides, you are one lucky break away from making 6 figures. No disrespect, I understand, but I just wanted to remind ya it ain't too bad. A Mesa/Hawaii 36k still puts you in the worldwide 1% as far as standard of living in my opinion.

For one you will have min days off at 11. Plan on working many 6 day in a row shifts with a 615am showtime and getting done at 830pm. 8 legs 4.5 hours block and you won't even break guarantee. Flying around beautiful Hawaii, believe me that gets old after filling out 48 weight and balance forms a week. I don't know what world you live in but a crappy one bedroom in Hawaii will cost you 1000.00 bucks, car payment, and food leaves you with nothing leftover. Yes Mesa is a much better place. I hold a line mainland and it's not to bad. But I can't rent a decent apartment. That should not be the case after working for a company with my qualifications after 8 years. Yes I'm in the top one percent of the world but not Hawaii. I also didn't grow up in a small town in Siberia chunking spears at fish either. I have a job, some don't, yes it could be worse. But I have expectations for myself. And Sniper, from regional to mainline is not a lateral move, even if your a Captain. I will leave in a heartbeat when I get my chance. But also understand living in base, over 50 and being too risky to get furloughed at that age is why our Captains will stay. And if the economy takes another downturn, no more hiring, I'm done. You can have that 36,000 a year. I made twice that bartending in my twenties. Thing is, there are ton of other jobs out there that pay more if you have the brains and work ethic.

Last edited by skillett; 04-03-2013 at 04:54 PM. Reason: ad sentence
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Old 04-03-2013, 08:39 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by skillett View Post
For one you will have min days off at 11. Plan on working many 6 day in a row shifts with a 615am showtime and getting done at 830pm. 8 legs 4.5 hours block and you won't even break guarantee. Flying around beautiful Hawaii, believe me that gets old after filling out 48 weight and balance forms a week. I don't know what world you live in but a crappy one bedroom in Hawaii will cost you 1000.00 bucks, car payment, and food leaves you with nothing leftover. Yes Mesa is a much better place. I hold a line mainland and it's not to bad. But I can't rent a decent apartment. That should not be the case after working for a company with my qualifications after 8 years. Yes I'm in the top one percent of the world but not Hawaii. I also didn't grow up in a small town in Siberia chunking spears at fish either. I have a job, some don't, yes it could be worse. But I have expectations for myself. And Sniper, from regional to mainline is not a lateral move, even if your a Captain. I will leave in a heartbeat when I get my chance. But also understand living in base, over 50 and being too risky to get furloughed at that age is why our Captains will stay. And if the economy takes another downturn, no more hiring, I'm done. You can have that 36,000 a year. I made twice that bartending in my twenties. Thing is, there are ton of other jobs out there that pay more if you have the brains and work ethic.
Ahh Skillet you make me smile. What you say is true to a point, I’ve been based in Honolulu and YES it is a difficult place to make it on Mesa FO pay. Now if I remember correctly Skillet you are TDY so you get per diem and a hotel so forgive me if I can’t let it pass that you are some kind of authority on living in Hawaii. I did it without per diem and with out a hotel and guess what it can be done! You are correct we do only have 11 days a month off, and there are days you have to work from 6:15am-8:30pm but the are not the rule. Most days are from 6-2 or 2-8. Yes there are a lot fatigue calls because of those 6am-8pm days, those days suck period. If you need to call in do it, you shouldn’t have to but yes they build some crappy lines with those days built in. I’ll give that one to you. Your next point is rent, again your TDY please don’t talk about things you have no experience with. Rent, if you want to live within a few blocks of Waikiki is going to be high. I’ve seen 1 bedroom without kitchens for over $3000 a month near the beach! If you move inland just 10-15 blocks rent drops off to $750-$850 even below is not unheard of. I’ve lived in Arizona myself and I paid $750 for an apartment and it was more then a few blocks from the ocean. Next time you talk about rent look at places in Salt Lake, Ewa Beach, and Waianae THEN tell the world all you know about renting in Hawaii.
I do feel bad for you having to fill out up to 48 weight and balances a week for only $36,000 a year. I’m sure the person who has come into your TDY hotel room pick up your dirty towels and clean the tub feels bad for you filling out 48 pieces of paper a week. I know the rookie cop who may get shot every time he/she pulls over a car feels bad you have so much paperwork to do. I’m sure the CFI who flying with a bunch of foreign students feels horrible for you too. If you don’t like your Hawaii schedule then don’t bid for Hawaii TDY.
My point: GET OVER YOURSELF. There are people trying to make informed choices about their flying future. You’re not helping at all by telling only partial truths or stretching the facts. Hate to break it to you but the fact that you are a regional pilot does not make you special. There are 600 or so people at Mesa alone just like you. Do something different to stand out. Instead of complaining how much Mesa sucks do something to change it (how about saying something like if you come to Mesa and you get based in Hawaii feel free to email me and I’ll help you out any way I can). That would be something different around here! I am saying this to you Skillet but in no way am I singling you out. I was in IAD not to long ago and there was a guy who as talking about wanting to upgrade but he wasn’t going to upgrade if he was going to get stuck in Hawaii. He went on and on how Mesa sucks because he would be a Captain in Hawaii. My question to him was simple “So you came to Mesa, a place that has a Hawaii base and you may get based there as a junior Captain and it’s the companies fault?”
The door out of Mesa Airlines doesn’t have any bars on it. Like you said if you had the brains or work ethic there are a ton of other jobs. I don’t know you but maybe you are short on both fronts and that’s why your still here. I doubt you are short on either brains or work ethic but complaining about everything is always so much easier then doing something to change your situation. This is all you need to say to anyone thinking about coming to Mesa.
TO ALL THOSE THINKING ABOUT APPLYING AT MESA: MESA HAS A HAWAII BASE AND IF YOU COME HERE YOU MAY BE ASSIGNED HERE AT SOME POINT.
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Old 04-03-2013, 09:41 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by skillett View Post
For one you will have min days off at 11. Plan on working many 6 day in a row shifts with a 615am showtime and getting done at 830pm. 8 legs 4.5 hours block and you won't even break guarantee. Flying around beautiful Hawaii, believe me that gets old after filling out 48 weight and balance forms a week. I don't know what world you live in but a crappy one bedroom in Hawaii will cost you 1000.00 bucks, car payment, and food leaves you with nothing leftover. Yes Mesa is a much better place. I hold a line mainland and it's not to bad. But I can't rent a decent apartment. That should not be the case after working for a company with my qualifications after 8 years. Yes I'm in the top one percent of the world but not Hawaii. I also didn't grow up in a small town in Siberia chunking spears at fish either. I have a job, some don't, yes it could be worse. But I have expectations for myself. And Sniper, from regional to mainline is not a lateral move, even if your a Captain. I will leave in a heartbeat when I get my chance. But also understand living in base, over 50 and being too risky to get furloughed at that age is why our Captains will stay. And if the economy takes another downturn, no more hiring, I'm done. You can have that 36,000 a year. I made twice that bartending in my twenties. Thing is, there are ton of other jobs out there that pay more if you have the brains and work ethic.
I am asking a serious question. Why do you stay? Take your own advice and leave for goodness sake. I really, really dislike flying with guys like you, who seem to think that the world owes you anything. Maybe if life had been a little more difficult for you, you would appreciate some of the positive things that go on around you, and wouldn't feel the need to complain so much about the difficult things. I guess it is just a lack of maturity.
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:00 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by GearMover View Post
Ahh Skillet you make me smile. What you say is true to a point, I’ve been based in Honolulu and YES it is a difficult place to make it on Mesa FO pay. Now if I remember correctly Skillet you are TDY so you get per diem and a hotel so forgive me if I can’t let it pass that you are some kind of authority on living in Hawaii. I did it without per diem and with out a hotel and guess what it can be done! You are correct we do only have 11 days a month off, and there are days you have to work from 6:15am-8:30pm but the are not the rule. Most days are from 6-2 or 2-8. Yes there are a lot fatigue calls because of those 6am-8pm days, those days suck period. If you need to call in do it, you shouldn’t have to but yes they build some crappy lines with those days built in. I’ll give that one to you. Your next point is rent, again your TDY please don’t talk about things you have no experience with. Rent, if you want to live within a few blocks of Waikiki is going to be high. I’ve seen 1 bedroom without kitchens for over $3000 a month near the beach! If you move inland just 10-15 blocks rent drops off to $750-$850 even below is not unheard of. I’ve lived in Arizona myself and I paid $750 for an apartment and it was more then a few blocks from the ocean. Next time you talk about rent look at places in Salt Lake, Ewa Beach, and Waianae THEN tell the world all you know about renting in Hawaii.
I do feel bad for you having to fill out up to 48 weight and balances a week for only $36,000 a year. I’m sure the person who has come into your TDY hotel room pick up your dirty towels and clean the tub feels bad for you filling out 48 pieces of paper a week. I know the rookie cop who may get shot every time he/she pulls over a car feels bad you have so much paperwork to do. I’m sure the CFI who flying with a bunch of foreign students feels horrible for you too. If you don’t like your Hawaii schedule then don’t bid for Hawaii TDY.
My point: GET OVER YOURSELF. There are people trying to make informed choices about their flying future. You’re not helping at all by telling only partial truths or stretching the facts. Hate to break it to you but the fact that you are a regional pilot does not make you special. There are 600 or so people at Mesa alone just like you. Do something different to stand out. Instead of complaining how much Mesa sucks do something to change it (how about saying something like if you come to Mesa and you get based in Hawaii feel free to email me and I’ll help you out any way I can). That would be something different around here! I am saying this to you Skillet but in no way am I singling you out. I was in IAD not to long ago and there was a guy who as talking about wanting to upgrade but he wasn’t going to upgrade if he was going to get stuck in Hawaii. He went on and on how Mesa sucks because he would be a Captain in Hawaii. My question to him was simple “So you came to Mesa, a place that has a Hawaii base and you may get based there as a junior Captain and it’s the companies fault?”
The door out of Mesa Airlines doesn’t have any bars on it. Like you said if you had the brains or work ethic there are a ton of other jobs. I don’t know you but maybe you are short on both fronts and that’s why your still here. I doubt you are short on either brains or work ethic but complaining about everything is always so much easier then doing something to change your situation. This is all you need to say to anyone thinking about coming to Mesa.
TO ALL THOSE THINKING ABOUT APPLYING AT MESA: MESA HAS A HAWAII BASE AND IF YOU COME HERE YOU MAY BE ASSIGNED HERE AT SOME POINT.

Your going too send a new hire out to "no whiteboys in Waianae" to live because it's cheap. Yeah thats smart and over and hour (with a car) in traffic. I lived out in Hawaii long before Mesa. And just because I was TDY and you were making it work in Hawaii doesn't make you some Da Hui local. Mesa has been really good to me and I appreciate that. Yes I think smarter people could run the joint but many companies fall under the greed system of business. Hawaii is poorley ran and the airplanes are falling apart. Other than that Mesa is in very good position to be solid regional for years to come. But don't plan on getting PIC here for you new hires. It won't matter in 5 years anyway if the economy holds. I tell it like it is. You guys sound like some Mesa recruiters trying to save the airline from impending doom because there are not many qualified pilots out there. Regional pay is to low for the years, degrees and time invested. And I'm tired of no tea in the bags guys like you not standing up for better pay. You know who I am!

Last edited by skillett; 04-04-2013 at 12:23 AM. Reason: Explaination
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:40 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by maxjet View Post
I am asking a serious question. Why do you stay? Take your own advice and leave for goodness sake. I really, really dislike flying with guys like you, who seem to think that the world owes you anything. Maybe if life had been a little more difficult for you, you would appreciate some of the positive things that go on around you, and wouldn't feel the need to complain so much about the difficult things. I guess it is just a lack of maturity.
This is why this industry is so messed up. Your screwing with your own future at mainline because people like you are happy making 36,000 a year, 8 years into job at professional airline career. Next thing you know there will more dips willing to work for lower wages and cut you out of job. Yes the housekeeper makes crap. But the janitor is making twice the money you are. If this is a proud and prestigous job pay me like a professional. Thats all I ask. I'm negative on APC because it gets the steam out. Things are looking good and I think the pay will have to come up. But tell me to walk the plank after I worked this hard and come this far. And if your willing to go fly an Airbus for let's say 55,000 a year for the nxt 10 years. Tell everyone to walk if your not happy and complaining. You will have nothing but a bunch of people that have no business being in an airplane. If you want intelligent people in this business you got to pay them. Plane and simple.
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