squall line

Apples-oranges. Mesa is in contract negotiations and has been for years.

Consider this. Let's talk about recent events. CPZ got gains in their contract. Expressjet AND Envoy turned down contracts as of late. The ball was in PSA's court. Pilots are finally back in the drivers seat when it comes to negotiations. PSA didn't turn down the offer. I think that's the biggest problem/issue everybody has. Does this sound about right or am I off base?

pagey

Pretty much correct.

Unfortunately a wholly owned carrier is in a very different position from a stand alone regional carrier when it comes to negotiating. Comparing XJT, CPZ, and RAH votes to a PSA vote is well, to steal your term, apples to oranges.

Eagle's situation definitely more closely mirrors PSA's but they are also significantly larger, giving them more leverage with a no vote.

Everyone wanted PSA to vote no because "they can't shut you down, no one can staff your flying."

PSA had 49 acft at the time of our vote. We were told by "the industry" that there's no way AAG could shut us down anytime soon due to the pilot shortage. AAG is transferring 47 acft from Eagle to PSA in a little over a years time.

They absolutely could've shut us down, and would have.

The guys that voted yes mostly for our LOA were guys that have been around for years and had seen what Parker is, and how he operates. They decided he wasn't bluffing. It seems they were right.

24/48

First off, one is only a scab if they cross a picket line or if one flies struck work. Secondly, if we're talking about scab like behavior, then those who live in glass houses (Skywest pilots) should not throw stones! When Skywest bought ASA back in '05 from DAL I remember CR7's being ferried up to SLC to hand over to Skywest because Skywest flew them for less. In fact, our MEC Chair at the time told Jerry that it was a smart business move and that the 50 seaters should be transferred to ASA because we flew them for a $1 or $2 less than the Skywest folks, yeah that didn't happen.

But hey, that's how Skywest pilots roll, they've always ridden the coat-tails of the unionized carriers. CMR & ACA had killer contracts before 9/11/01 and Jerry gave the Skywest pilots something comparable in pay and QOL. Skywest was the darling of DAL for a while after the CMR strike because Skywest wasn't a strike threat, and that my friend put everyone else at a disadvantage.

Fast forward to today.....I hear Skywest pilots are referring to themselves as "mainline". Mainline what? Because your non-union outfit sits on the sidelines watching management screw over the ASA/XJT pilots? When was the last time you "mainliners" flew your own code? The flying you do on behalf of UA, DL, and AA is not mainline flying.

So sit there and rail on Mesa and their contract, and improperly label them scabs. Just know that us true mainliners don't like non-union pilots who go around calling union members in good standing scabs.

Have a nice day!

Bumbaclot

So far June 2014 guys got DFW in the first round. So yes it will go mid-junior. In the next couple months you will see new hires start to get it. Number 3 in base seniority First Officer at DFW is a May 2013 hire. So far 21 lines and 33 FO's in base for Nov.

Upgrade time is probably around 2yrs for a new new hire. Training CRJ is done in mostly in PHX with good instructors and good training environment. Challenging but laid back where you'll do well at it. E175 is done primarily in STL at FSI.

Crazy Canuck

Neither did PSA. I could understand your argument if Eagle had voted "no" and PSA had subsequently voted "yes," but it happened in the reverse order. So the argument that PSA pilots are lowlife scumbag scabs really holds no water.

I DO, however, join you in feeling like the concessional vote helps to drag the industry down. However, I am a grown man and don't hold personal childish vendettas against those who were looking out for themselves.

Also, fair enough on your contract. I wasn't suggesting it was worst in the industry (which is a subjective thing).

Crazy Canuck

1st of all, lol @ those calling us "mainline." Never heard that and it's blatantly ridiculous. SKW and XJT are completely different companies.

2nd of all, you just argued that "scab like behaviour" is X, then proceeded to tell me how OO pilots were "scabs" for doing Y. Nice logic!

I'm proud of being non union. Unions have helped run airlines in America into the ground. But hey, that's just my opinion, and you can feel free to kiss ALPA's ass if you want!

3. You have a nice day too

DENpilot

What timeline are you looking at?

Jul 2013 - Eagle votes to reject to "b" scale contract. AA immediately approaches PSA for concessions for a guarantee of 30 large aircraft.

Sept 2013 - PSA scum say yes.

March 2014 - Eagle once again approached for concessions for large aircraft. Pressure is higher now that PSA scum have p***ed on Eagle. (See the whipsaw?) Eagle tells AA to GFY.

Name User

May 2015 - AAG management announces the transfer of the remaining Envoy aircraft to Piedmont and Eagle will be wound down.

Envoy has a great group of guys but IMO they got cocky and forgot their place.

24/48

Think what you want my friend....

FerrisBluer