TankerDriver

We've had at least a dozen PC out of here in the past year. We have had no disapprovals that I know of. I even asked the separations airman in the MPF. We had a guy PCS into the squadron from an overseas PACAF assignment and get PC approval 3 months later.

Deskjockey

Pretty good discussion on Force Shaping. I'm currently in the AD on an overseas assignment. Missed the opportunity for VSP by ONE DAY if you can believe that (I'm over 12 on 30 Sep 2006)...

Very interesting to hear about the VSP approvals, WG/CC signoff, etc. I suspected that this opportunity would result in a flood of apps in light of the ops tempo. Just some food for thought, because I worry about the future of the AF and decisions like Force Shaping-

I'm not so sure that what we're seeing is just like the downsizing of previous generations of flyers. After Vietnam the force did downsize but we had people smoking dope on the flightline maintaining airplanes from what I've been told. We had "checkers checking checkers" back then, and a garrison force to quote AFPC's language....the biggest RIF was after the collapse of the Soviet Union - about a 40% cut. Today's force (at least everyone under 15 years of service) has seen nothing but downsizing (save a brief period of resurgence after 9/11 which was subseqently cut by Force Shaping I), erosion of benefits, longer deployments, "more with less" speak for as long as I've been in. I bleed blue and I'm in for the Big Win but I can definitely understand those who leave.

Truth is, the Air Force (and to some extent the Navy as well) is a service looking for a mission in the SHORT term, and budgets only look at the short term (gotta keep under end strength, right?). The money is supposedly going to "recapitalize" our aircraft fleet, so we reduce numbers to pay for equipment. But if you look at who's taking the brunt of the fall it's the technical workforce (1500+ engineers, scientists, and program managers) all of whom were offered bonuses to stay in 2003. So who will build the force of the future? Contractors who truly ARE motivated primarily by money? If anyone thinks the total defense budget will decrease as a result of personnel reductions they're crazy. The difference goes right back into the big defense industry to pay for the F-22 - the answer to all of our Air Dominance prayers.

It's going to be interesting to observe the pendulum swing the other way in about 5-10 years with the Air and Space Force wonders why hammers really do cost $500 and there's no one left to explain why. That is only if the price tag of an F-22 or JSF doesn't have you wondering already...

Andy

It doesn't accrue interest. You just have to pay it back; the payback formula in the 90s was divide the amount you receive by (# years of service X 2).
For instance, you receive $100K. You've got 10 years of service. $100K divided by 20 = $5K/yr payback for 20 yrs once you start getting a retirement, be it at age 60 or if you are able to pull out an active duty retirement.
In my case, I got out with 14 1/2 yrs in service & was paid ~$90K. I'll have to pay back just over $250/mo from my retirement check. I had originally planned on retiring from the Guard, but this thing called 911 turned my part time job into a full time job. As I approached 18 yrs time in service, I had to switch over to the Reserves so that I could continue to get waivers. I've got ~19 yrs time in service right now and will be getting orders for 179 days (max orders with a sanctuary waiver) in the new fiscal year, followed by another set of orders for ~150 days. I have to do drills (IDTs) and annual tour, hence the reason why that adds up to less than 365 days.

I was recently recalled to United, but I took a bypass so that I can stall going on mil leave (United allows me to take up to 6 yrs mil leave; I plan on taking the full 6 yrs).
I don't regret getting out of active duty; I wanted to continue to serve, but definitely enjoyed it a lot more in the Guard. Now, I will serve in a Reserve staff position and probably retire with ~25 yrs time in service. I'm an O-5 with a decent shot at O-6.

OK, that was too much information.

Andy

Shackone, all of these guys have served more than 99.5% of all Americans. That's duty enough in my book. I understand what you're saying, but a lot of them will continue to serve in the Guard and Reserve for many, many years.

I've been wearing a uniform for more than 26 years; I expect to wear one for another seven. Almost 15 of those years were on active duty. Toward the end of my active duty, I was a PITA; I hated the job. I was one of the first into the sand container back in Aug 89 and somewhere around my 15th 35+ day TDY to PSAB was enough to push me over the edge - there was no end in sight. Between 95&98, I spent almost half of my time deployed to a tent in sandland (dark days indeed). While I understand that it's 'different day same shiite' as everyone before us, keep in mind that there are many who are doing constant rotations to sandland ... it's been a continuous bad dream since '89. Ever since I went to the Guard and now am in the Reserves, I love the Air Force (I couldn't say that at the end of my active duty). I still flew out of sandland in the Guard, but I was there because it was MY choice - made all of the difference in the world; even when my unit went stop loss and we all deployed, I still felt like it was my choice to be there and serve. I'm now working as a staff puke, and I still love going to work every day.

None of these guys joined up with the intent to score $100K on the way out the door, but the AF is offering it because they want to reduce their manning numbers. If the AF wasn't overmanned, they wouldn't be offering it.
I'm not going to look down on someone who's decided that they're not career active duty material (especially since I'm not career active duty material ) and have the good fortune of being offered cash for something that they were going to do anyway.

Shackone, one last note - thank you for your service in the active duty. You served in a uniform longer than 99.9% of all Americans.

TankerDriver

My Palace Chase was approved. Took roughly 3-4 weeks from the day the package was submitted. Alittle less than 8 years left of my ADSC. 11M2F AFSC. FYI.

flyfish

I want to say thanks for all those who posted here. I finally had to log in myself and give my two cents. I'm a pilot in the United States Air Force for God’s Sake!...I dreamed about this since I was 4 years old. I, like others who've shared here, walked, talked, puked ‘military speak’ my entire life. I knew every plane in the inventory by shape and size before I entered the third grade. There was never a doubt… I WAS going to be a pilot for the US Air Force! The way I see it, I've served and sacrificed in one respect or another for over 30 years now. I've been in for 8 and I spent my previous life sacrificing as a dependent gazing up at my father who served as a pilot. I never wanted anything to do anything else. It didn't matter what hoops I had to go through. Medicals, college, push-ups...whatever...I wanted it more than the other guy and I made my dream come true. I worked extremely hard to get where I am. My brother served for 10 years on 141's during the 80's and 90's. My uncle served in 141’s before he flew commercial. My cousin fly's fighters and my other cousin is just now entering pilot training. It's in my family's blood. Why then, do I hate it so much? I'll admit it. I'm completely unhappy and disillusioned in the military. I can make the same complaints as others here but I see both sides...things weren't any better for my father or brother. I didn't even know my father growing up. He was gone 4 weeks at a time or working 16 hour days in the barrel or off to school for 4 months at a time etc... I have 250 hours of flying in two years and I’m a captain! I wanted to be a pilot for the Air Force not the telephone control officer! It was the same then as it is now. I for one feel that I only have one life to live and need to get ‘Get busy livin’ or get busy dyin.’ I've served my country and have great memories of living in tents for half my career and barely knowing my family. I can fly my way from Baghdad to any airbase in the Persian Gulf by the sight of oil fires alone. I’ve read the Dear Boss letter and sadly agree. It was written in 97…10 years ago! Apparently things haven’t bottomed out yet. If the man who wrote that is in charge now, where are the fruits of his sacrifice? 40,000 more people on the Force Shaping Board? He drank the Kool Aid for sure just like the rest of our leadership…They were ‘completely surprised’ at how many 11M’s volunteered for VSP. Is our leadership out of touch????

VSP??? Proud to accept it! I’ll use it for a down payment on my fishing cabin on a cold Montana River. No one will tell me to wear my reflective belt out there. One life to live….your call!

Tanker-driver

But the Air Force tld me that if we didn't wear our reflective belts, the sky would fall!

flyfish

Some news on VSP...this comes from a C-130 pilot I know at Dyess. With lack of information out there we're required to get it by other means. They told me (from their MPF) the first come first serve thing went out the door when 1, they realized the number of people they had apply and 2, they didn't take into account different time zones before releasing the hounds. They realized the date-time zone thing in Japan gave everyone a jump in the pacific and Europe. So their answer??? To hand all the applications over to the functionals and they figured it out...or something along those lines. It's second hand info but no one is around to dispute it. The 1st come 1st served thing isn't true then (according to Dyess MPF). If that is the case our careers are in the hands of the assignments guys. Keep the fingers crossed that everyone will get a fall out slot and this thing will be over in a couple of weeks. Let's all get a beer together with our $100K.

Let's all helmets with our reflective gear!

dazdandconfused

Does anyone have any gouge on how many slots have been filled/ or are still available. I'm in the 98 year group and a 11M. I saw that the matrix went up to 59 people. I recently put in for the VSP, but haven't heard anything. Anyone out there have gouge??

FredtheGnome

Reading Air Force Times... here are some quotes

"Officials approved 1192 VSP applications by Set 25. about a third of the 3200 goal."

"We're at about 1840 applications, roughly, at the moment"

"According to my guys, we only had 10 VSP applications that trickled in last week"

I put in my app last week. As a 98 guy, you have a couple things in your favor. I know quite a few guys put off applying not wanting to burn the bridge with the majors board.

Also, many guys thought that they were not qualified due to the UPT ADSC. You need to write a letter to HQ/AFPC to waive the ADSC and include it in your package. We've had people get approved for the waiver already.

I think there were about 400 11Ms in the 98 year group. Not sure on that number, it is just an educated guess. Adjust those numbers a bit for guys who already palace chased, and again for guys who are staying in... and you probably have good odds of getting approved.

Good luck on getting the bonus.