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Are 135 Operators lacking pilot applicants?

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Part 135 Part 135 commercial operators

Are 135 Operators lacking pilot applicants?

Old 02-22-2007, 04:48 PM
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Default Are 135 Operators lacking pilot applicants?

With all the hiring that is going on at the regionals, has the 135 operators found it difficult to find new pilots? American Eagle, Mesa, Express Jet, and other regionals are beginning to scrape the bottom of the barrel looking for FOs. This being said, I was being persued by a 135 company for a job where I had to pay them $5,000 training fee and my wage would have been only $18,500/yr. I would think with this these conditions, this company wasn't having any difficulty finding pilots. - I did turn that down by the way.

Thoughts?
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Old 02-22-2007, 04:57 PM
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If you are referring to 135 passenger ops I don't think many are hurting because of the regional hiring. I think thats for two reasons: 1) most 135s require more time than a regional so those people are prob going there because they eventually want to go fly corporate, or 2) if you happen to get a charter job in your hometown then you wont be open to the commutting or moving to a new city like many regional pilots do. Just my .02, but as a 135 pilot I don't see our company having a tough time finding people.
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Old 02-23-2007, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by TpropDrvr View Post
If you are referring to 135 passenger ops I don't think many are hurting because of the regional hiring. I think thats for two reasons: 1) most 135s require more time than a regional so those people are prob going there because they eventually want to go fly corporate, or 2) if you happen to get a charter job in your hometown then you wont be open to the commutting or moving to a new city like many regional pilots do. Just my .02, but as a 135 pilot I don't see our company having a tough time finding people.
I have to agree with TpropDrvr. Most pilots at 135 jobs either have a job that doesn't require commuting, or they're making more money than they would be at the regionals. I know personally that at Ameriflight, pilot's will be marking more at a Piper Cheiftain Captain than an FO at most regionals. Our base pay is around $24,000/yr. There is also a lot of opportunity to make more in during the year and upgrades to turboprops are about 7 months away from date of hire.
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Old 02-23-2007, 04:44 PM
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We have no problem finding people interested, but we do have problems finding people that can hold their own in single-pilot IFR. We washed out 4 of 6 in 2006. We really haven't lost the last 3-4 of us full-time guys like our company typically does at the 12 month mark, things are going good here, which has held the current guys in for less turnover.

BTW, that $5k training and only 18k/yr pay is a joke. Glad you said no. Also kudos for not dragging the name into it, but I have an idea who that is.
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:19 PM
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I generally try to be upbeat and not get too involved in the name calling so common on this forum. However, I must say the way Regionals treat their people is disheartening and many of the 135 operators I have seen have low pay and poor schedules for us non-vampire types.

I got a late start in aviation and have been at this for only 6 years, but of the pilots I know, few are making more than just enough to barely get by, some not even that. It would be interesting to know how many pilots have gone bankrupt trying to make it to FedEx, UPS, American, ect.
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Old 03-10-2007, 08:38 PM
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135 Operators are in serious danger. I do not give them many more years in operation. Not many 135 operators will be able to stay in business.

Really? Yes and that because of the Pilot shortage that is already a reality. Desperate pilots taking any kind of job for the hours or as a step into experience necessary for applying to the regionals are soon history.

Who will accept what the small 135 night cargo companies have to offer? flying all night in old equipment freezing like hell, loading and unloading their airplanes many times per night and being forced to fly in any kind of weather, accepting mechanical problems in the name of operational interest? and that being paid 1700 to at the most 3000 per month before tax?

The regionals are taking every trainable pilot available in the market and we have only seen the start. The Regionals needs 7000 to 10000 new pilots during 2007. The big airlines will be seriously start hiring at the end of 2007 and even more during 2008 taking most of the new pilots from the US regionals and they will need even more pilots. The international market need for US pilots mainly in Asia (China, etc) will increase dramatically.

Who will want to fly for the 135 operator? All night? for what? for nothing?

Corporate and Charter operators will also increase the demand for pilots. The 135 operators that will survive are the ones that will be able to increase the salaries seriously and will have to treat their pilots like kings to make them stay. Who will financially be able to do that? The days of the night working slaves will soon be over..............................
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Old 03-10-2007, 10:04 PM
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The market goes in cycles, and I can tell you from my Climbto350 membership, the 135 guys are looking like crazy. Worst thing is most ops are single-pilot IFR, so you need the 1200TT, which obviously the airlines don't for the SIC's.

Another thing is my company does pay well. $27k/yr rate after you complete your check-ride, and a nice raise @ the 6mo. check-ride also. It's a different environment for sure, but I'll take it any day to flying for the airlines.
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Old 03-10-2007, 10:37 PM
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$27k is being well paid? My father has a GED, no college and earns over $60k driving a big dump truck.

I know a training captain at a 135 in the Southwest that flies c404 and c310. He said they can't find pilots. As you said on this thread. Night IFR mins far exceed what the regionals require, some currently "close to 500TT".

I agree, I don't know of too many pilots that would fly an old prop airplane at night, by themselves when they could be in a jet.

Flight schools aren't pumping out new pilots like they used to either. Pan Am is full of Chinese now, very few Americans left getting into aviation and SkyWest announced they will be at PanAm next week to recruit more pilots. It should be interesting if this trend continues for another 5 years
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Old 03-10-2007, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Lanesuzza View Post
$27k is being well paid? My father has a GED, no college and earns over $60k driving a big dump truck.
Comparatively speaking to airlines, unfortunately yeah. So far my pay increases have kept me above a comparative Airline guy, with same amount of time in company, even with a 1yr upgrade to captain at the regionals. Not bad for flying pistons. And yeah, there's a 90% chance this summer I will be flying one of them new fangled VLJ's. So there is upgrades, just in a different sense.

My dad farms, just a high-school degree, but a ton of blood, sweat, and tears type of job. You get out of it what you put in. Unfortunately for us Pilot guys, it takes a long time to see that return, but hey, we're flying planes!!!!!! Sooner than later I hope it changes, but the market determines that.
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Old 03-11-2007, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by theskyisclear View Post
135 Operators are in serious danger. I do not give them many more years in operation. Not many 135 operators will be able to stay in business.

Really? Yes and that because of the Pilot shortage that is already a reality. Desperate pilots taking any kind of job for the hours or as a step into experience necessary for applying to the regionals are soon history.

Who will accept what the small 135 night cargo companies have to offer? flying all night in old equipment freezing like hell, loading and unloading their airplanes many times per night and being forced to fly in any kind of weather, accepting mechanical problems in the name of operational interest? and that being paid 1700 to at the most 3000 per month before tax?

The regionals are taking every trainable pilot available in the market and we have only seen the start. The Regionals needs 7000 to 10000 new pilots during 2007. The big airlines will be seriously start hiring at the end of 2007 and even more during 2008 taking most of the new pilots from the US regionals and they will need even more pilots. The international market need for US pilots mainly in Asia (China, etc) will increase dramatically.

Who will want to fly for the 135 operator? All night? for what? for nothing?

Corporate and Charter operators will also increase the demand for pilots. The 135 operators that will survive are the ones that will be able to increase the salaries seriously and will have to treat their pilots like kings to make them stay. Who will financially be able to do that? The days of the night working slaves will soon be over..............................
I have to say I agree with you,,, Very good post.

Dont forgett the Very Light Jets that coming out very soon,,,, more pilots. The pilot shortage just started and it will get worst, if you dont belive me just look at the various orders from different carries around the world, India, China, Europe, and USA.

I have a feeling that we will see a shortage of CFI's very soon. No cfi's and no pilots and the demand keep growing.

I just saw an ad on climbto350 that a 135 operator that usually require 1200 tt for 135 (IFR) minimums, lowered their minimums to 500tt. Pilots will fly under 135 vfr minimums. CRAZY

I never forgett when I was a freshman for 4 years ago my instructor was struggling to get with the regionals told me that when I graduate the market will start picking up,,,,, He was right

Good Luck guys,

KDUA
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