Lost decade 2.0?
08-20-2020 | 04:55 AM
#171
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,682
Likes: 167
Howdy. 20y/o here. Worked hard since I was twelve both in and out of school, saved my money + I have parents who are stable enough to help me on my feet. Graduated HS with 30 college credits knocked down for free (dual enrolled) and was fortunate enough to have my parents pay for me getting my PPL. I followed the advice of damn near every person I interacted with and went to Auburn. My one year at Auburn getting my IR cost me approx. $42k in student loans (after my parents burned through our college fund).
AU was an out of state decision, if I had stayed in state we would be looking somewhere in the range of $25-30k for the cost of this year. Regardless of any of that if I had stuck it out at AU I'd graduate about 160-170k in debt, and in state+pt.61 lessons (where I switched) will run me about 100k all in. How the hell do you save for that? The answer is you don't. You take out loans.
My friends who made the "right" decision to leave their state to go to AU and receive training will be making approx. $1600/month minimum payments for about 12 years after they graduate. I'll be joining them with approx. $1000/month payments over the same timeframe.
Once we graduate we're looking at regionals/CFI'ing for 2-10ish years. Post tax take home of what? 3000 a month? MAYBE 4?
Listen, I love the Dave Ramsey advice, but some of us are following it all and still going to be at the very least inhibited by this. I'm not trying to say I have it better or worse than anybody before me, but I am trying to help you recognize sometimes certain obstacles are just damn near insurmountable and millenials/gen z are not just a bunch of avocado toast eating starbucks drinking yuppies wondering why we can't lease a Bimmer rent a 2 bed in DUMBO and get breakfast out everyday
AU was an out of state decision, if I had stayed in state we would be looking somewhere in the range of $25-30k for the cost of this year. Regardless of any of that if I had stuck it out at AU I'd graduate about 160-170k in debt, and in state+pt.61 lessons (where I switched) will run me about 100k all in. How the hell do you save for that? The answer is you don't. You take out loans.
My friends who made the "right" decision to leave their state to go to AU and receive training will be making approx. $1600/month minimum payments for about 12 years after they graduate. I'll be joining them with approx. $1000/month payments over the same timeframe.
Once we graduate we're looking at regionals/CFI'ing for 2-10ish years. Post tax take home of what? 3000 a month? MAYBE 4?
Listen, I love the Dave Ramsey advice, but some of us are following it all and still going to be at the very least inhibited by this. I'm not trying to say I have it better or worse than anybody before me, but I am trying to help you recognize sometimes certain obstacles are just damn near insurmountable and millenials/gen z are not just a bunch of avocado toast eating starbucks drinking yuppies wondering why we can't lease a Bimmer rent a 2 bed in DUMBO and get breakfast out everyday
08-20-2020 | 06:09 AM
#172
On Guard!
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 1,181
Likes: 0
08-20-2020 | 06:26 AM
#173
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
1. Don't borrow money for a useless degree. Save money first, then go to school. Or get the military or an employer to pay for tuition.
2. Don't borrow money for a car you don't need. Reliable used cars can be had for $2500 or less all day. My last airport junker cost me $500 to purchase, I put 200k miles on it, and sold it for $500. Average cost of maintenance per year was $1200. Or get a bike. Or take public transport.
3. Don't rent a luxury 1BR apartment for $1500. Rent a non-luxury 2 BR/1BA apartment for $1200 and split it with a friend.
4. Don't borrow money for Starbucks, drinks out, and whatever else that millennials use credit cards to blow crazy money that they don't have.
5. Don't adopt a furry "friend" so unnecessarily early in life. Some study I found on the internet says that 57 percent of millennial households own a pet and the generation is 77 percent more likely than other generations to get a pet before they marry or have children. And many millennials make their home buying decisions based upon their pet. Something like one-third of millennials, which is the largest group of home buyers, buy a new home to have more space or a better yard for their dog. This age group also spends more on their dogs, with purchases of pet care items, toys, treats, and vet visits. None of this is necessary, but they won't admit that when they're whining about being unable to save for a house or a retirement when they're spending at least $15,000 on their dog over its lifetime (my guess is that it's much higher than that number. Save the dog for the retirement when you need an excuse to get out of the house and go to the park, enjoy not having that responsibility when you're 25-35 so you can go pick up extra shifts or spend a weekend out of town.
There's a ton of other ways to save money without living a miserable life, however millennials just can't admit that they're suffering from extreme lifestyle creep that is a product of being raised by boomers who've benefited more from economic growth than any other generation in the history in the world. Millennials are trying to live the boomer lifestyles that their parents do, without being willing to live well within their means for a decade or two to establish themselves financially first.
2. Don't borrow money for a car you don't need. Reliable used cars can be had for $2500 or less all day. My last airport junker cost me $500 to purchase, I put 200k miles on it, and sold it for $500. Average cost of maintenance per year was $1200. Or get a bike. Or take public transport.
3. Don't rent a luxury 1BR apartment for $1500. Rent a non-luxury 2 BR/1BA apartment for $1200 and split it with a friend.
4. Don't borrow money for Starbucks, drinks out, and whatever else that millennials use credit cards to blow crazy money that they don't have.
5. Don't adopt a furry "friend" so unnecessarily early in life. Some study I found on the internet says that 57 percent of millennial households own a pet and the generation is 77 percent more likely than other generations to get a pet before they marry or have children. And many millennials make their home buying decisions based upon their pet. Something like one-third of millennials, which is the largest group of home buyers, buy a new home to have more space or a better yard for their dog. This age group also spends more on their dogs, with purchases of pet care items, toys, treats, and vet visits. None of this is necessary, but they won't admit that when they're whining about being unable to save for a house or a retirement when they're spending at least $15,000 on their dog over its lifetime (my guess is that it's much higher than that number. Save the dog for the retirement when you need an excuse to get out of the house and go to the park, enjoy not having that responsibility when you're 25-35 so you can go pick up extra shifts or spend a weekend out of town.
There's a ton of other ways to save money without living a miserable life, however millennials just can't admit that they're suffering from extreme lifestyle creep that is a product of being raised by boomers who've benefited more from economic growth than any other generation in the history in the world. Millennials are trying to live the boomer lifestyles that their parents do, without being willing to live well within their means for a decade or two to establish themselves financially first.
08-20-2020 | 07:21 AM
#174
Banned
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,208
Likes: 7
Because according to their website tuition is $24k/yr and their flight training is about $50k total:
https://www.mtsu.edu/aerospace/docs/Pro-Pilot-FAQ.pdf
So that's going to be about $150k for a degree and certs not counting living expenses.
08-20-2020 | 07:47 AM
#175
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 3,578
Likes: 48
From: Semi-Retired...
If anybody is going to be updating or remaking their logbook, I highly recomend the NC-Software products. Their LogBook Pro has been the standard by which others get compared for decades. They've been doing logbooks for over 20 years.
LogBookPro lets you import schedules right from most airline and corporate flight scheduling software. You then just add the tail number, and OOOI info from ACARS, or to keep it simple, do Out & In only. You can enter it on your phone app and cloud sync in to your desktop later. The desktop lets you export/import in just about any format, including Jep style format. You can exen send it out in PDF format. Pretty easy to combine reports and printouts into a nice PDF logbook which you can then printout at Fedex or Staples for the big interview.
If you want to really get fancy, their AirlinePilotDailyLogbook does all the above, but also tracks your duty time, per diem, pay credit for the month, weather for departure/destination, delays, and even tracks available commute flights. I used APDL and found that if my check was more than $5 off every month, the company screwed up someplace.
They aren't the cheapest programs out there these days, but they are the BMW/Mercedes/Lexus version.
https://a.nc-software.com/aw.aspx?B=36&A=271&Task=Click" .
LogBookPro lets you import schedules right from most airline and corporate flight scheduling software. You then just add the tail number, and OOOI info from ACARS, or to keep it simple, do Out & In only. You can enter it on your phone app and cloud sync in to your desktop later. The desktop lets you export/import in just about any format, including Jep style format. You can exen send it out in PDF format. Pretty easy to combine reports and printouts into a nice PDF logbook which you can then printout at Fedex or Staples for the big interview.
If you want to really get fancy, their AirlinePilotDailyLogbook does all the above, but also tracks your duty time, per diem, pay credit for the month, weather for departure/destination, delays, and even tracks available commute flights. I used APDL and found that if my check was more than $5 off every month, the company screwed up someplace.
They aren't the cheapest programs out there these days, but they are the BMW/Mercedes/Lexus version.
https://a.nc-software.com/aw.aspx?B=36&A=271&Task=Click" .
08-20-2020 | 07:57 AM
#176
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 45,150
Likes: 802
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
Never understood delaying happiness and fulfillment until you’re in your “retirement years”. Not saying to be financially irresponsible, but if you make the money then you should enjoy the life. Nobody is guaranteed to make it to those retirement years. Everyone is one car crash, heart failure, or fell down the stairs and broke my neck away from death. I know people that saved up and did everything they can to retire. They only enjoyed it for a couple years before they passed away suddenly. Be smart with the money, but also enjoy life. You only have one life to live after all. That’s my soap box for the day!
That allowed me to afford aviation and in my late 40's everything all kind of came together and suddenly you wake up wealthy. Did not require FIRE-esque self-denial but I saved more than average and worked more than average too, rather than searching far and wide for pastimes to consume my time off and money. Flexible outside employment/skills help... I did more outside work when the industry was slow, focused more on time building when it was appropriate.
Six months ago I told people that I slow-rolled my aviation career progression too much and in 20/20 hindsight I should have focused more on aviation, and more aggressively. Now with 20/15 hindsight I guess I'm glad I have some eggs in other baskets.
08-20-2020 | 08:08 AM
#177
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 1,323
Likes: 1
Millennials are squarely in their 30s now bud. Pets are a lot cheaper than kids. Millennials save and value their money more than any generation since the Great Depression. Your example of an extreme coffee and pet loving life style was humorous though. THEY WANT IT ALL
These kids and their lawns, DERK MY LAWN
These kids and their lawns, DERK MY LAWN
08-20-2020 | 08:12 AM
#178
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 45,150
Likes: 802
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
There are multiple layers of software, most pilots should be able to hand the layers closest to the end user (ie Java, Python stuff). The deeper layers require deeper skills and obscure languages, acquired via a software engineering/CS degree or lengthy OJT experience in the right environment (and usually pay better than front-end hacking).
Last edited by rickair7777; 08-20-2020 at 08:25 AM.
08-20-2020 | 08:12 AM
#179
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 1,323
Likes: 1
What year did he graduate?
Because according to their website tuition is $24k/yr and their flight training is about $50k total:
https://www.mtsu.edu/aerospace/docs/Pro-Pilot-FAQ.pdf
So that's going to be about $150k for a degree and certs not counting living expenses.
Because according to their website tuition is $24k/yr and their flight training is about $50k total:
https://www.mtsu.edu/aerospace/docs/Pro-Pilot-FAQ.pdf
So that's going to be about $150k for a degree and certs not counting living expenses.
08-20-2020 | 08:18 AM
#180
I Pass the Butter
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 555
Likes: 0
Millennials are squarely in their 30s now bud. Pets are a lot cheaper than kids. Millennials save and value their money more than any generation since the Great Depression. Your example of an extreme coffee and pet loving life style was humorous though. THEY WANT IT ALL
These kids and their lawns, DERK MY LAWN
These kids and their lawns, DERK MY LAWN
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