Go Back  Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Regional
Mesaba flow up/flow down with NWA >

Mesaba flow up/flow down with NWA


Notices
Regional Regional Airlines

Mesaba flow up/flow down with NWA

Old 06-13-2007, 05:35 PM
  #1  
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
 
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,242
Default Mesaba flow up/flow down with NWA

The NWA MEC today approved a flow up/flow down agreement with the company for Mesaba. Any thoughts about how this might make Mesaba more attractive or not.
maddogmax is offline  
Old 06-13-2007, 05:42 PM
  #2  
Line Holder
 
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: SAAB driver in training......
Posts: 64
Default

Sources??????? If thats true thats awesome!
warriordriver is offline  
Old 06-13-2007, 05:44 PM
  #3  
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
 
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,242
Default

The NWA MEC Hotline
maddogmax is offline  
Old 06-13-2007, 06:04 PM
  #4  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Ftrooppilot's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Body at sea level; heart at 70,000+
Posts: 1,349
Default

Sorry for the long post. Last December I posted some speculation, then followed up a month later. It now looks like much of the speculation has become fact. What happens to Compass seems to be the one remaining issue.


Originally Posted by Ftrooppilot (6 months ago)

FACTORS
NWA owns 30+ % of Mesaba (Mair Holdings)
NWA Senior Management owns a significant % of Mesaba (Mair Holdings)
NWA owns Mesaba aircraft and equipment
Mesaba is a "body factory." No concrete and bricks to purchase.
NWA has new CRJs and ERJs comming (may need court approval)
NWA short routes with average load factor can be flown by 90 seaters.
NWA pilots object to any regional flying aircraft with over 50 seats.

GOAL
Increase MAIR holdings stock value . (Management makes money.)
Reduce costs by using CRJs instead of A-320s, etc.on some routes
Avoid NWA pilot protest over commuter 90 seat issue.
Exercise greater control over owned assets.
Have a solely owned regional capability (like COMPASS was to be.)
Maintain crew staffing levels. Avoid eventual pilot shortage.
Make money.

SOLUTION
Assign 50 seat CRJs / ERJs to regional contractor (not Mesaba). (To Pinnacle then 17 back to Mesaba)
Purchase Mesaba (ready made regional airline) (Done)
Incorporate Mesaba personnel into NWA. (Done ???)
Assign 90 seat CRJs to NWA (former Mesaba personnel) (Mesaba - for now)
Establish a "flow through" for crew members. (Done as of today)

RESULTS
NWA Makes money and comes out of bankruptcy. (Done)
NWA senior managers make money on their[Mesaba] stock.
(Check both Mesaba and NWA management bonuses)
NWA pilots are happy that 50 seats and below go to regionals. (Done - with flow back they have access. )
NWA has regional capability (foil to testy regional contractors) (Done)
Former Mesaba pilots are happy to be part of NWA with flow through. (Happy with CRJs / Now have flow through)
Compass option is cancelled. (IMHO - It will happen.)
NWA avoids a potential pilot shortage at the "major" level. (Draw from Mesaba)

And they all lived happily ever after.

.

Batting average isn't bad. My best guess - Compass will fade into the sunset or disolve into NWA. The ERJs will go to Mesaba or NWA mainline. Much depends upon the finalized relationship after NWA purchases Mesaba. Will the name Mesaba be dropped ? Lots of interesting senarios possible.
Ftrooppilot is offline  
Old 06-14-2007, 05:01 AM
  #5  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Tinpusher007's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: 330 B
Posts: 1,610
Default

Very, very interesting!
Tinpusher007 is offline  
Old 06-14-2007, 05:06 AM
  #6  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: CRJ
Posts: 2,356
Default

Originally Posted by Ftrooppilot
And they all lived happily ever after.
uh,, thats what pinnacle thought when they bought us and gave us lots of planes while downsizing mesaba. Oh and we had a weak "flowthrough", (ask the furloughed dc9 captains here all about that) which was really a flow back since no one went up. like i have said before you guys will get built up and i can bet you dollars to donuts that within 2 years you will be sold to the highest bidder, and the cycle will repeat itself once again.
Airsupport is offline  
Old 06-14-2007, 05:31 AM
  #7  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 7ER B...whatever that means.
Posts: 3,968
Default

Originally Posted by warriordriver
Sources??????? If thats true thats awesome!
Yeah, if you want to make crap flying for a mainline carrier whose management would pimp out their own grandmothers on a street corner if it would raise their stock price 1%
freezingflyboy is online now  
Old 06-14-2007, 05:31 AM
  #8  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: A-320
Posts: 6,929
Default

Flowthrough ha?, for what its worth CAL is taking more XJT guys now than they did with the "Flowthrough"
JoeyMeatballs is offline  
Old 06-14-2007, 05:36 AM
  #9  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 7ER B...whatever that means.
Posts: 3,968
Default

And depending on how its worded, beware of "flowthrough" agreements. They almost always benefit the mainline pilots more than the regional partner. Now the mainline pilots who are eligible for flowthrough (or "flowback", as it were) have a guaranteed safety net. What do you (as a regional pilot) have? A chance to go up to mainline? Whoopdy fricken do! How bout you pay me more at the regional level and shove your flowthrough up your a$$.
freezingflyboy is online now  
Old 06-14-2007, 05:37 AM
  #10  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Ftrooppilot's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Body at sea level; heart at 70,000+
Posts: 1,349
Default

Originally Posted by Airsupport
. . . i have said before you guys will get built up and i can bet you dollars to donuts that within 2 years you will be sold to the highest bidder, and the cycle will repeat itself once again.
Possible. Don't have a "dog in this fight." Never been employed by an airline but enjoy doing analysis. Past economic moves (NWA/Pinnacle history) don't always predict future decisions.

In my (humble uneducated) opinion, if anything is sold it will be the Compass operating certificate - but not ERJs which will go to NWA (possibly MESABA) to replace DC9s. Doing so will "uncomplicate" the NWA / Mesaba / Compass relationship and management effectively having to deal with three Corporations (redundant expensive management) and three employee union groups.

Time will tell.
Ftrooppilot is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Eric Stratton
Major
33
06-21-2007 07:53 AM
АЕРОФЛОТ 214
Regional
69
06-15-2007 09:01 PM
skid
Regional
16
02-21-2007 05:58 AM
Topper
Regional
17
01-30-2007 12:33 PM
saab340driver
Regional
1
11-09-2005 01:30 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Your Privacy Choices