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Old 04-13-2008, 04:14 PM   #1  
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Default Effect on Regionals, DAL/NWA Merger

Ok so here's my question

Assuming the Delta NW merger occurs this week as rumored, how will this affect the regionals that fly for each airline?

Delta has already been planning to cut 8 regionals back to 4. Now with the addition of NWA's regional partners, which regionals will suffer if any and which will we likely see continue to fly for Delta?

I'm supposed to begin a Shuttle America class soon and wondering if I will be affected in the immediate, near, or distant future...

I know that Shuttle also flys United stuff so I may have nothing to worry about. I guess maybe it depends on where they need pilots the most...the Delta or United side.

I just hope that my class doesn't cancel seeing as how I've already turned in my notice at my old job.

Thanks for any help or information you can offer!
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Old 04-13-2008, 04:41 PM   #2  
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How or why would a regional airline pilot know the answer to this?
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Old 04-13-2008, 04:46 PM   #3  
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I don't expect anyone including mainline guys to have an exact answer for this. Its very up in the air. I'm just wondering if anyone has an educated guess. Me personally, I'm new to the 121 side of things beginning with this job and haven't been following all the posts on all these boards regarding the issues. I'm just trying to understand the effects of the merger by asking you guys and reading the other posts on this board as well as others.

Of course theres the game of trying to distinguish for myself who seems to have an accurate knowledge of the subject and who is just throwing crap out there...haha

Anyways just wondering
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Old 04-13-2008, 04:55 PM   #4  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty MCfly View Post
I don't expect anyone including mainline guys to have an exact answer for this. Its very up in the air. I'm just wondering if anyone has an educated guess. Me personally, I'm new to the 121 side of things beginning with this job and haven't been following all the posts on all these boards regarding the issues. I'm just trying to understand the effects of the merger by asking you guys and reading the other posts on this board as well as others.

Of course theres the game of trying to distinguish for myself who seems to have an accurate knowledge of the subject and who is just throwing crap out there...haha

Anyways just wondering

It's anyone's guess what will happen, if it happens. There are way too many variables to account for and things change literally daily around here in the 121 world. If I may give you two simple rules to live by as you begin your airline adventure:

1. Never say never. Anything is possible in this business. Unexpected news and problems are a part of this business.
2. Don't believe anything you see or hear, especially from another pilot. Rumors are just that -- rumors. Until you see it actually happen or show up on property, don't count on anything. If you start listening to half of what you are sure to hear, you'll drive yourself nuts. Don't lose focus and fly standard! Good Luck!!

Last edited by RJtrashPilot; 04-13-2008 at 05:12 PM.
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Old 04-13-2008, 05:09 PM   #5  
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Just going on pure speculation... I think you would have to look at when each contract expires as well as the major players. Plus the fact that NW owns Mesaba and Delta owns Comair. Could there be a forced merger of regionals? Not sure if thats possible but its a thought, both fly the CRJ and with the cost of fuel the SF340 is a plus for XJ. Skywest and ASA have the largest combo of flying in the DL network and from what it seems DL is happy with their performance in the network. RAH has the presence in the Embraer in CVG and ATL, and Pinnacle is flying the CRJ900 out of ATL. On the NW side Pinnacle flies a ton flying the CRJs plus what seems interesting (someone posted a few weeks ago they have some Q400s on order). And of course there is always MESA...

Just seems with the cost of fuel, who knows NW and DL might consolidate XJ and Comair (just my opinion and guess) If will come down to who performs the best and is the most cost effective. Really just like my opinion it could go various ways and could change, plus contracts come into play.

But if delta wanted to cut its regionals from 8 to 4 before a merger, post merger it would add mesaba into that total....
My guess to a FINAL 4 of regionals in a NWA/Delta merger... would be
- Skywest/ASA
- Mesaba and Comair (who knows they might combine since "Delta" would own both)
- Pinnacle
- Republic

While eventually booting Mesa once the contract is up

Besides it would take prob 5 - 8 years before a pure consolidation would occur and things would be running efficiently... so those regionals listed might have different contracts, and bases of operations.

But thats just a guess... this is new territory under the current market and cost of oil and who knows the merger may never get approved
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Old 04-13-2008, 05:19 PM   #6  
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Originally Posted by BHopper88 View Post
Just going on pure speculation... I think you would have to look at when each contract expires as well as the major players. Plus the fact that NW owns Mesaba and Delta owns Comair. Could there be a forced merger of regionals? Not sure if thats possible but its a thought, both fly the CRJ and with the cost of fuel the SF340 is a plus for XJ. Skywest and ASA have the largest combo of flying in the DL network and from what it seems DL is happy with their performance in the network. RAH has the presence in the Embraer in CVG and ATL, and Pinnacle is flying the CRJ900 out of ATL. On the NW side Pinnacle flies a ton flying the CRJs plus what seems interesting (someone posted a few weeks ago they have some Q400s on order). And of course there is always MESA...

Just seems with the cost of fuel, who knows NW and DL might consolidate XJ and Comair (just my opinion and guess) If will come down to who performs the best and is the most cost effective. Really just like my opinion it could go various ways and could change, plus contracts come into play.

But if delta wanted to cut its regionals from 8 to 4 before a merger, post merger it would add mesaba into that total....
My guess to a FINAL 4 of regionals in a NWA/Delta merger... would be
- Skywest/ASA
- Mesaba and Comair (who knows they might combine since "Delta" would own both)
- Pinnacle
- Republic

While eventually booting Mesa once the contract is up

Besides it would take prob 5 - 8 years before a pure consolidation would occur and things would be running efficiently... so those regionals listed might have different contracts, and bases of operations.

But thats just a guess... this is new territory under the current market and cost of oil and who knows the merger may never get approved
good points....I was wondering that too...If NWA and DAL merge would there contracts with the regionals change...for example if NWA eventually became Delta, is Delta still required to hold true to NWA's old regional contracts with pinnacle mesaba etc. or is there a clause that would cancel such contracts and only require delta to hold true to its pre-merger contracts.

Just another thing that I have no idea about in the 121 side of things.

thanks for the positive responses fellas
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Old 04-13-2008, 05:51 PM   #7  
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Originally Posted by Marty MCfly View Post
Ok so here's my question

Assuming the Delta NW merger occurs this week as rumored, how will this affect the regionals that fly for each airline?

Delta has already been planning to cut 8 regionals back to 4. Now with the addition of NWA's regional partners, which regionals will suffer if any and which will we likely see continue to fly for Delta?

I'm supposed to begin a Shuttle America class soon and wondering if I will be affected in the immediate, near, or distant future...

I know that Shuttle also flys United stuff so I may have nothing to worry about. I guess maybe it depends on where they need pilots the most...the Delta or United side.

I just hope that my class doesn't cancel seeing as how I've already turned in my notice at my old job.

Thanks for any help or information you can offer!
Who told you that? I only count 6 DCI carriers:
ASA/Skywest
Comair
Republic et al
Mesa
Pinnacle
ExpressJet

Who did I leave out?

In addition to that, since the Comair strike, Delta has shown they are interested in diversifying the DCI fleet and they've upheld that with the addition of Pinnacle and ExpressJet to the DCI family. If anything, I see Mesa on the outs (Delta has already reported they are terminating the contract), Pinnacle continuing to fly for both NWA and DAL, ASA/Skywest continuing to do what they do because the contracts are long-term and their performance doesn't suck. If CAL cuts more ExpressJet birds loose it's possible a few may end up in the Delta fleet replacing Mesa in the East or providing more feed out of LAX. As far as RAH, I guess the 135s are on their way out but Delta seems happy with the 170s...for now. If they are as thirsty vs. the CRJ-7/900 as some people claim, Delta may start to rethink that fleet or how they use them.

Just my opinion. But opinions are like bumholes...everyone has one and they usually stink

Last edited by freezingflyboy; 04-13-2008 at 06:04 PM.
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Old 04-13-2008, 06:04 PM   #8  
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Someone posted a rumor on our union board stating the new "TA" the pilots of Delta agreed on has language in it that would bring scope back to 70 seats (i.e. Delta would be flying those aircraft). I don't have any facts to back it up, but isn't that what these boards are all about???
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Old 04-13-2008, 06:09 PM   #9  
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Originally Posted by ComairFO View Post
Someone posted a rumor on our union board stating the new "TA" the pilots of Delta agreed on has language in it that would bring scope back to 70 seats (i.e. Delta would be flying those aircraft). I don't have any facts to back it up, but isn't that what these boards are all about???

Until scope is written as a weight class it won't matter. Take a few coach seats out of a 900 and add some first class seats and WOLA 70 seats.
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Old 04-13-2008, 06:15 PM   #10  
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Originally Posted by ComairFO View Post
Someone posted a rumor on our union board stating the new "TA" the pilots of Delta agreed on has language in it that would bring scope back to 70 seats (i.e. Delta would be flying those aircraft). I don't have any facts to back it up, but isn't that what these boards are all about???
I hope you're right. It's about time a pilot group started taking back what is rightfully theirs.
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