Thanks for the informative, well-written post, Lambourne. It reminds me of the time at ASA when Delta bought us, our MEC petitioned Delta's MEC to merge our seniority lists. Delta MEC proposed a flow-through, but our hard-core senior MEC chairman insisted all or nothing, and we ended up with nothing. Had it been put to a vote, I'm confident we would have achieved a flow-through at least.

 

I dont understand why this isen't the venue? Its a public discussion forum.

The MEC's #1 priority should be is to protect its pilots. We have ZERO rights to representation. Yes there are other pressing issues, to include safety. But this is public enemy number one. We got a million LOA's over a gamut of issues, but still no representation. ALPA preaches schedule with safety, but our pilots can not advocate safety if they're getting suspended/fired. And please spare me with the standard "why dont you volunteer for us" line.

How about some REAL answers, to some REAL pressing problems?

 

You have my email address. Phone number is on the ALPA website.

I will be happy to go over these issue one by one and give you REAL answers.

 

You are misinformed. Take Brett up on his offer and send him an email or give him a call.

 

Thanks for the info. I will admit that I have not done a lot of research on this issue. The one thing I know is that well before my time at the regionals started the RJ somehow made it out of the hands of mainline pilots. I also know that this let the RJs get out of control to the point were a majority (51 or 52%) of domestic flying is now done by a RJ. Years ago a co-worker of mine was hoping that we would get 70 seat jets (we only had T-Props) and I told him he was stupid. That the 70 seat jets belong at mainline so that we can get out of the regionals and onto mainline...he looked at me like I had 3 heads...

I don't want spend a decade in the regionals, but that date is closely approaching. I understand that the only way that the industry will have any hope is for the mainline guys to take a stand and scope RJs back in. It will be best for everyone. I think the work rules (mainly cba duty limits and number of min days off) and staffing issues alone would minimize the number of furloughs that would happen, compared to adding more RJs to the regionals.

I also hope that the UAL/CAL guys realize that the industry is counting on them to stand up and keep the CAL scope or better.

 

How gracious of you to allow us an ab-initio position in the right seat of the Saab.

Hold on a minute.... Ab-Initio?????

With a separate hiring "funnel"? And how would one transition from the TPs to the mighty JETS? Perhaps it would require ..... another interview???

Can I get a "B" scale to go with that?



Well, maybe you aren't too proud to fly an RJ, but you sure seem to have a low opinion of turboprops..... and that pretty much proved my point.

 

I am not a doctor so I can't help you overcome your inferiority complex that seems to be plaguing you. You yourself brought up the payrate for a 34 seat TP being an issue. If everyone gets a seniority number when they are hired does it matter what you call the program? Ab-initio is pretty much what takes place at some of the carriers, but those pilots don't get a mainline seniority number. You get guys/gals with minimum qualifications and you have a low time Captain mentoring them. If you want to upgrade the regional product in both service and safety you make it part of the entire mainline.

It is obvious you have chewed on some sour grapes for too long. Good luck in your career at Colgan and achieving your career goals. Just don't be upset if your mainline partner isn't your partner in the future and you are hoping your company can secure another contract or start down the road of removing airframes ala Comair.

L

 

I hate to burst your bubble about putting the "less-experienced" pilot in the 340 with this ab-intitio deal, but there are probably some mainline pilots that have NEVER landed an airplane on a runway that is less than 6000', at an uncontrolled field or really had to deal with the kind of conditions that us "bush-league" 340 pilots do. Not a battle of egos for with this issue, I am merely stating the facts. In fact, some of these mainline guys with A LOT of experience have later struggled when going back to King Airs, old-school Citations and the like, because they just can't think outside the narrow box of mainline carrier mentality...So, flame away oh gods of the "big jets".

 

There may be a FEW but the majority of the pilots at the mainline carrier do have strong backgrounds. I won't judge the entire regional pilot population on the Colgan pilots at BUF.

I never called the 340 pilots bush league. But you don't get too many pilots coming from the military or other carriers at Colgan. You get entry level employees fresh out of training/instructing. What is the bad idea of the mainline controlling who it puts into aircraft with its logo on the side? The screening and ab initio programs would be beneficial to the young folks that tend to wind up at carriers like Colgan.

Sure some of the old guys going back to corporate after retirement have struggled. No doubt about it. They have had flown with single and double augmented crews in a structured environment for 20+ years. What is the saying about old dogs, new tricks? Proof that you don't get better with age, but don't tell ALPA that.

Short runways? Give me a break, look at SNA, SAN, DCA RWY31 or 1/19 for that matter and tell me that the major carrier pilot doesn't operate in a challenging environment. You can throw in foreign ATC, backside of the clock flying and many other challenges that are not experienced by the TP guys. It is the same job with different challenges.

You guys want to make this about who has the longest johnson and I want to make this about creating mainline jobs at the regional. If you spend years at colgan wouldn't you like to have that time applied toward your seniority at the mainline carrier? As it is now when you leave that company for a another you bring zero longevity to the party.

Good luck.

L

 

I hate it but 90% of the suspensions and terminations at cjc were warranted. There is always more to the story that what is heard around the crew room. The MEC Prostans committee has received over 150 handoffs from the chief pilots office that resulted in no action being taken against the pilot period. Yes, representation is needed, but our pilots also have a duty under the code of ethics to act professionally and safely. As Professional pilots, you have a resource in your professional standards committee to help identify and rectify crew issues among your peer group before it ever reaches management. If we are not helping and protecting our own group from those that need more help or guidance, then we are gambling with our future by putting it in the hands of management.