American Eagle reaches TA w/ pilots
10-21-2011, 04:57 PM
#21
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Position: doggy style
Posts: 1,006
Seniority based pay is a bunch of bull****. I am convinced the AE MEC is in bed with management on this one. They are clearly not looking out for their pilots best interests.
This could be one scary industry leading contract... basically no movement=no pay raise. Again, bull****.
This could be one scary industry leading contract... basically no movement=no pay raise. Again, bull****.
10-21-2011, 05:08 PM
#22
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Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: back in the right
Posts: 406
Originally Posted by BlueMoon
First off, I don't work at AE, but I used to work at a company that took concessions, twice, and still got downsized and had to start over. I wouldn't vote for something just to "keep the company around a little longer", you may be severely disappointed.
The new pay system doesn't sound too great. Are they passing any of that savings on to the pilots? Training is "a cost of doing business", pilots shouldn't have to subsidize that for the company.
Also, I'd be wary about the financial penalty for parking aircraft. ALPA gets to decide what to do with the cash...hell no. All cash from penalties with regards to fleet reduction should be divided amongst the furloughed and downgraded as a result of those aircraft being parked.
The new pay system doesn't sound too great. Are they passing any of that savings on to the pilots? Training is "a cost of doing business", pilots shouldn't have to subsidize that for the company.
Also, I'd be wary about the financial penalty for parking aircraft. ALPA gets to decide what to do with the cash...hell no. All cash from penalties with regards to fleet reduction should be divided amongst the furloughed and downgraded as a result of those aircraft being parked.
10-21-2011, 05:24 PM
#23
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Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 820
Originally Posted by DashDriverYV
ditto. Same concession talk at yv, how are things going there. F it, vote no and park the planes, they lose too.
Who loses?? AA? They just bid it out and take all our EXEC and bring them to AA. Only pilots/fas lose, since they prol will keep the ground handling how it is.
10-22-2011, 06:15 AM
#25
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Position: FO
Posts: 3,032
Originally Posted by Nevets
Can someone explain what is so bad about a blended rate? Works for the IPA doesn't it?
It's a jam job.
10-22-2011, 06:35 AM
#26
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Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 133
Well the 135 and 140 rates go away so everyone will receive 145 pay. Since our reserve pay for CA is half 135pay the other half 145 pay, so for most pilots it will be a raise initially. Even the ATR pay is more than the blended 135/145 pay for someone at the 5-6 year pay scale. What really sucks is if you fly the CRJ you will be paid either ATR or EMJ pay basically forever. But you will know that when you bid is since everyone that already holds the CRJ will be grandfathered.
10-22-2011, 06:52 AM
#27
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Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,350
Just read over the thing and..............it SUCKS.
One way or another, Eagle is going to be getting rid of all the little ERJ's and transitioning to 70-seat CRJ's. With the exception of a small number of very senior pilots who don't leave, virtually ALL their future CRJ captains will be on ERJ or ATR rates. Starting in a few years, the new management gets to cut everyone's pay down based on what ever the average is out there, so that's a second pay cut.
Right now, AMR can farm out flying. This contract would allow them to cut the pay now and then still farm out all the flying in a few years when they can scrap the agreement.
Eagle pilots are suckers for falling for this proposed contract.
One way or another, Eagle is going to be getting rid of all the little ERJ's and transitioning to 70-seat CRJ's. With the exception of a small number of very senior pilots who don't leave, virtually ALL their future CRJ captains will be on ERJ or ATR rates. Starting in a few years, the new management gets to cut everyone's pay down based on what ever the average is out there, so that's a second pay cut.
Right now, AMR can farm out flying. This contract would allow them to cut the pay now and then still farm out all the flying in a few years when they can scrap the agreement.
Eagle pilots are suckers for falling for this proposed contract.
10-22-2011, 07:48 AM
#28
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: EMB 145 CPT
Posts: 2,934
Originally Posted by Nevets
Can someone explain what is so bad about a blended rate? Works for the IPA doesn't it?
It's a jam job.
10-22-2011, 08:10 AM
#29
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Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: back in the right
Posts: 406
Originally Posted by eaglefly
Just read over the thing and..............it SUCKS.
One way or another, Eagle is going to be getting rid of all the little ERJ's and transitioning to 70-seat CRJ's. With the exception of a small number of very senior pilots who don't leave, virtually ALL their future CRJ captains will be on ERJ or ATR rates. Starting in a few years, the new management gets to cut everyone's pay down based on what ever the average is out there, so that's a second pay cut.
Right now, AMR can farm out flying. This contract would allow them to cut the pay now and then still farm out all the flying in a few years when they can scrap the agreement.
Eagle pilots are suckers for falling for this proposed contract.
One way or another, Eagle is going to be getting rid of all the little ERJ's and transitioning to 70-seat CRJ's. With the exception of a small number of very senior pilots who don't leave, virtually ALL their future CRJ captains will be on ERJ or ATR rates. Starting in a few years, the new management gets to cut everyone's pay down based on what ever the average is out there, so that's a second pay cut.
Right now, AMR can farm out flying. This contract would allow them to cut the pay now and then still farm out all the flying in a few years when they can scrap the agreement.
Eagle pilots are suckers for falling for this proposed contract.
10-22-2011, 11:26 AM
#30
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Joined APC: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,707
No I have not read all the post.
1. ALPA AE MEC is in the back pocket of MGT.
2. This is a concessionary contract with pay cuts to start in 3 years
3. ASA (air service agreement) with AA was not extended just the reduction of flying slowed from 3 to 5 years. the reduction will still happen.
4. the formula for pay raises will result to zero percent increase.
5. banded pay is smoke and mirrors to pay reductions in 3 years via more concessionary negotiations.
6. No pilot ratification after this one time only in 2011.
7. Scope on aircraft was given away by the mec and unfortunately the short sighted newbies.
8. ALPA is to receive almost 10 million dollars from AA in penalties if they AA do not replace any parked aircraft. ALPA not the pilots get the money. This is a guarantee to happen because 1 plane cost 20 million so parking 50 airplanes and only paying 10 million as a kick back to ALPA, for ALPA willingness to see AMR way, is a small fee to AA.
Other than that the ALPA MEC and the negotiating committee along with half the LEC's who are selling the pilots out for a preferential hiring to AA have done a great job for management.
DFR suit will be happening.
But please dont let this stop from new applicants to AE please keep applying you will be the first to leave on extended vacation due to this contract if passes.
1. ALPA AE MEC is in the back pocket of MGT.
2. This is a concessionary contract with pay cuts to start in 3 years
3. ASA (air service agreement) with AA was not extended just the reduction of flying slowed from 3 to 5 years. the reduction will still happen.
4. the formula for pay raises will result to zero percent increase.
5. banded pay is smoke and mirrors to pay reductions in 3 years via more concessionary negotiations.
6. No pilot ratification after this one time only in 2011.
7. Scope on aircraft was given away by the mec and unfortunately the short sighted newbies.
8. ALPA is to receive almost 10 million dollars from AA in penalties if they AA do not replace any parked aircraft. ALPA not the pilots get the money. This is a guarantee to happen because 1 plane cost 20 million so parking 50 airplanes and only paying 10 million as a kick back to ALPA, for ALPA willingness to see AMR way, is a small fee to AA.
Other than that the ALPA MEC and the negotiating committee along with half the LEC's who are selling the pilots out for a preferential hiring to AA have done a great job for management.
DFR suit will be happening.
But please dont let this stop from new applicants to AE please keep applying you will be the first to leave on extended vacation due to this contract if passes.
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