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View Poll Results: Should Regional Airlines Flatten Pay Scales
Yes, and I am a Regional Airline Captain 10 6.10%
Yes, and I am a Regional Airline First Officer 39 23.78%
Yes, and I am a Prospective Regional Airline Pilot 7 4.27%
Yes, and I am a Major Airline Pilot 11 6.71%
Yes, and I am a Non Airline Pro Pilot 6 3.66%
No, and I am a Regional Airline Captain 27 16.46%
No, and I am a Regional Airline First Officer 36 21.95%
No, and I am a Prospective Regional Airline Pilot 1 0.61%
No, and I am a Major Airline Pilot 22 13.41%
No, and I am a Non Airline Pro Pilot 5 3.05%
Voters: 164. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-27-2014, 12:02 PM   #21  
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Originally Posted by l2flare View Post
Question is dumb, pretty much no one thinks Ca's and Fo's should be paid the same rate. However, regional divide between the two positions is higher then the major and higher then what Alpa claims their ideal monetary distribution should be.

Better would be, "Should there be SOME flattening of pay scales?". Ya probably.

But a better solution would be just to pressure for a reduction of the regional to major gap as a whole, preferably until FFD is no longer viable and we call the last 20 years a mulligan and move on.
apparently as of now 21 (24%) of the voters think so.....
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:27 PM   #22  
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I hate this phrase so much. Making 20k a year is not paying your dues.

What about those who have been furloughed or their airline closed shop and they had to start over? Didn't they already pay their dues? What about guys who want to come to an airline from the 91/135 world and have already flown crap equipment, or worked for crap companies, just to build hours, haven't they paid their dues?

All you people who use "pay your dues" as an excuse for low pay need a reality check.
I came from a long stretch in the Part 135 world. You wouldn't have and never will hear me complain about pay and benefits I agreed to work for. It is dues paying for the vast majority such as yourself. As for those furloughed from other airlines, I agree, they've paid their dues and deserve a spot above you on the F.O. list.
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Old 08-27-2014, 02:19 PM   #23  
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No it's not. Also, a lot of the people I know who are choosing to stay at regionals for quality of life would never come on an anonymous message board and insult others for their career choices. You could be so much better than you choose to be.
That's a huge problem. Regionals are simply not meant to be career destinations. The selfish lifers take an excessive piece of the pie. This is the primary cause of low entry level wages. The company sets the size of the pie, the senior pilots get to divy it up at the expense of the newbies.
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Old 08-27-2014, 04:33 PM   #24  
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That's a huge problem. Regionals are simply not meant to be career destinations. The selfish lifers take an excessive piece of the pie. This is the primary cause of low entry level wages. The company sets the size of the pie, the senior pilots get to divy it up at the expense of the newbies.
If you're unhappy about this, quit the airline business today! If and when you get to your dream job, you're going to learn that the senior bubbas have it made.

Save yourself from a few decades of unhappiness. Quit now. Take the cubicle job.

The better answer should be, NO, we shouldn't flatten the pay scales. We should raise the pay for our regional partners.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:46 PM   #25  
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Fact is, regionals are a career destination for many. A friend retired from NWA on DC-9s flying what...regional routes that are now at regionals.

GF
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:48 PM   #26  
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I dont think it should be even but defiantly flattened out. This will give you better earnings over the long haul. Earn more earlier in your career will allow for more compounding interest. We should all hope for 4 year caps(with cola increases and contract raises) but at reasonable wages. If we had it by the 2 or worst case 3 year of your career you would be making at least 50k no matter the seat you are better off in the long run even if you don't get that nice 85k at year 7.
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Old 08-29-2014, 12:10 PM   #27  
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Yup, very short sighted on their part. They are mostly made up of the entitlement generation so there ya have it.
FO pay should be roughly 70% of Captain Pay. That way both FO and Captain can eat and pay their bills....

but the Captain has more responsibility, and liability and puts their good name, record, and certificates on the line much more not to mention is supposed to be more experienced and knowledgeable in order to make decisions, with that "more experience and responsibility" should come higher pay.

"Lets pay everyone the same thing regardless of the job they do"
-First Officer Joe Stallin and Flight Attentant Karal Marks.

No but seriously, while it does suck to be a low paid fo especially when making lateral moves, ****ting on captains who spent the last 6-10 years in the right seat with that same ****ty pay busting their asses to earn their seats and higher pay is not right, and you're lowering everyone's top end right along with it. Lets be real, that isn't how capitalism works though I won't make the old Ayn Rand style "if the captain isn't paid more than the FO, what motivation does the FO have to be captain?" comment.
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Old 08-29-2014, 02:15 PM   #28  
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Why do regional CAs deserve 70k plus?

The question shouldn't be whether they subsidize FOs by taking a pay cut.

Regional CAs should be punished for not moving on.

Or we could continue to give them money: 401k 12.5% of the first 125% of yearly pay...

I don't think entitlement generation as much as I feel it's a lead weight of guys who screwed up so bad they are stuck in those seats.
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Old 08-29-2014, 02:16 PM   #29  
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As far as responsibility, violations come in pairs, and I've had to save many hapless lifers from getting ME violated.
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Old 08-29-2014, 03:31 PM   #30  
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Quote:





Originally Posted by Delta1067


Yup, very short sighted on their part. They are mostly made up of the entitlement generation so there ya have it.




FO pay should be roughly 70% of Captain Pay. That way both FO and Captain can eat and pay their bills....

but the Captain has more responsibility, and liability and puts their good name, record, and certificates on the line much more not to mention is supposed to be more experienced and knowledgeable in order to make decisions, with that "more experience and responsibility" should come higher pay.

"Lets pay everyone the same thing regardless of the job they do"
-First Officer Joe Stallin and Flight Attentant Karal Marks.

No but seriously, while it does suck to be a low paid fo especially when making lateral moves, ****ting on captains who spent the last 6-10 years in the right seat with that same ****ty pay busting their asses to earn their seats and higher pay is not right, and you're lowering everyone's top end right along with it. Lets be real, that isn't how capitalism works though I won't make the old Ayn Rand style "if the captain isn't paid more than the FO, what motivation does the FO have to be captain?" comment.
There's just so much wrong with this kind of thinking.

Captains and FOs have the same training. They have the same type ratings. They have the same ATP certificates. The physical safety of both is equally at risk. Both have an equal responsibility for the safety of the passengers (FOs can kill everyone on board just the same as a captain can).

Captains put their good name and record on the line much more than FOs? How is that?? FOs put their records and certificates on the line just the same. So often both the captain AND the FO get fired and/or violated for incidents and accidents.

I realized a long time ago that captains do not earn their seats, as you suggest. If that was true, then how do you explain some regional captains upgrading in 18 months while others don't make it to the left seat for 8 years? Did the 8 year FO perform so poorly that it took him nearly 5 times longer to earn what the other guy did? It's simply a matter of luck and timing when someone is able to upgrade.

The pay scale disparity is completely asinine. You mentioned capitalism as if it's a factor; free market capitalism is no where to be found in unionized airline pilot pay scales. Companies hand over a certain amount of money to the whole pilot group, and unions divide up the money in a very artificial, anti free-market type of system.
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