USAir rejected takeoff - gear collapse
02-27-2016 | 07:21 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,534
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From: A320 CA
From the report:
"According to Airbus, the RETARD alert is designed to occur at 20 ft radio altitude on landing and advise the pilot to reduce the thrust levers to idle. "
Now, I don't fly a bus and never have ... but is this REALLY the level of automated assistance that we, as professional pilots, are required to have these days to simply fly a plane??? Being told to "Retard" the thrust levers on landing??
"According to Airbus, the RETARD alert is designed to occur at 20 ft radio altitude on landing and advise the pilot to reduce the thrust levers to idle. "
Now, I don't fly a bus and never have ... but is this REALLY the level of automated assistance that we, as professional pilots, are required to have these days to simply fly a plane??? Being told to "Retard" the thrust levers on landing??
02-27-2016 | 08:02 PM
#12
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,292
Likes: 2
From: 747
In an Airbus autoland, the thrust will automatically come back to idle while the thrust levers themselves will still be in the climb detent (they dont move themselves, only the pilot flying can move them). The RETARD callout is a reminder to physically bring the levers to idle as the auto spoiler logic requires the levers to be in the physical idle position before the spoilers deploy. It's basically an aural input in place of a disagree light--they don't want you to override spoiler deployment and invalidate your landing data.
Not trying to stir the pot, I'm just fascinated by the different logic of Airbusses.
02-28-2016 | 05:34 AM
#14
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My day ends like that; only place a banana goes is the blender. Positioned around a fair share on the milk run bus, don’t recall ever sitting through a “bad” landing. No clue about the design but assuming everything works as advertised, how unlikely is it to really bang one?
02-28-2016 | 09:31 AM
#15
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From: Under the Frog
Sooooo ... the thrust levers don't actually adjust the thrust? There are simply detents that pilots place them in to correspond to the desired phase of flight? Or are there also modes that allow the pilot to actually have more of a "direct" control over a variable thrust setting?
Not trying to stir the pot, I'm just fascinated by the different logic of Airbusses.
Not trying to stir the pot, I'm just fascinated by the different logic of Airbusses.
Same thing.
In fact, it's exactly the same thing Boeing does, except the thrust levers don't move, whereas in the Boeing the throttles do.
There is a mode that allows the pilot to have more direct control of the engines. It's called "Autothrust: OFF."
There are three detents for the thrust levers (out of idle)
TOGA
Flex
Climb
TOGA and Flex are used for takeoffs. Climb is used for everything else. When the thrust levers are in the Climb detent the Autothrust has a range anywhere from Idle to full Climb power. The only way to know what the engines are doing at any given moment is to look at the screens.
02-28-2016 | 10:04 AM
#16
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From: Downward Dog
In an Airbus autoland, the thrust will automatically come back to idle while the thrust levers themselves will still be in the climb detent (they dont move themselves, only the pilot flying can move them). The RETARD callout is a reminder to physically bring the levers to idle as the auto spoiler logic requires the levers to be in the physical idle position before the spoilers deploy. It's basically an aural input in place of a disagree light--they don't want you to override spoiler deployment and invalidate your landing data.
Pilot problem stuff solved.
02-28-2016 | 10:19 AM
#17
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Joined: Jul 2007
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From: 767 Captain
I clicked them off on almost every approach. Not a huge fan of auto-throttles when hand flying anyway. But, if you're going to keep them on, if they move under your hand at least you can stay aware of what the A/T system is attempting to do (without looking at engine instruments). There are plenty of times with conventional A/T that a PF may decide to override the A/T with more thrust sooner, keep them from coming all the way back or something else. Having them sit in a detent hoping the behind the green door magic is going to take care of everything with the only manual option to completely click them off is AFU, in my opinion.
02-28-2016 | 02:54 PM
#18
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From: Airbus 319/320 Captain
In an Airbus autoland, the thrust will automatically come back to idle while the thrust levers themselves will still be in the climb detent (they dont move themselves, only the pilot flying can move them). The RETARD callout is a reminder to physically bring the levers to idle as the auto spoiler logic requires the levers to be in the physical idle position before the spoilers deploy. It's basically an aural input in place of a disagree light--they don't want you to override spoiler deployment and invalidate your landing data.
02-28-2016 | 11:14 PM
#19
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Joined: May 2007
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From: A320 CA
From the flight manual:
Retard Mode: commands A/THR to idle in the flare during AUTO LAND. IDLE is
displayed on FMA column one and on the E/WD. RETARD callout is generated at 10' RA
• Note •
Manual thrust reduction is required if A/THR disconnects in
the flare. RETARD callout is generated at 20' RA.
FLARE mode engages at approximately 40’ RA. At 30’ RA the AP/FD aligns the yaw
axis with the runway centerline and commands a flare. If A/THR is active, thrust is
retarded.
Last edited by blastoff; 02-28-2016 at 11:37 PM.
02-28-2016 | 11:39 PM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,534
Likes: 1
From: A320 CA
Sooooo ... the thrust levers don't actually adjust the thrust? There are simply detents that pilots place them in to correspond to the desired phase of flight? Or are there also modes that allow the pilot to actually have more of a "direct" control over a variable thrust setting?
Not trying to stir the pot, I'm just fascinated by the different logic of Airbusses.
Not trying to stir the pot, I'm just fascinated by the different logic of Airbusses.
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