135 considering 121
11-01-2022 | 03:03 AM
#31
At your mom's house
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,674
Likes: 449
From: cpt 737
Flew with a cpt that averaged 170/month. His rolling 365 block was always above 990. Guy said he needed to fly that much because his monthly bills was 28k. His wife had to get a job so they had some extra cash.
dude has an impressive collection of toys and houses tho.
I really like these how much can you make by flying more stories. Maybe one day we'll hwe'll some I made this much by only working my line because we get paid a good rate?
probably not tho
dude has an impressive collection of toys and houses tho.
I really like these how much can you make by flying more stories. Maybe one day we'll hwe'll some I made this much by only working my line because we get paid a good rate?
probably not tho
11-01-2022 | 06:18 AM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 7,573
Likes: 282
From: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Flew with a cpt that averaged 170/month. His rolling 365 block was always above 990. Guy said he needed to fly that much because his monthly bills was 28k. His wife had to get a job so they had some extra cash.
dude has an impressive collection of toys and houses tho.
I really like these how much can you make by flying more stories. Maybe one day we'll hwe'll some I made this much by only working my line because we get paid a good rate?
probably not tho
dude has an impressive collection of toys and houses tho.
I really like these how much can you make by flying more stories. Maybe one day we'll hwe'll some I made this much by only working my line because we get paid a good rate?
probably not tho
11-01-2022 | 06:22 AM
#33
gets time off
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,512
Likes: 93
11-01-2022 | 06:32 AM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 7,573
Likes: 282
From: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
I just don’t see how flying that much with only 4-5 days a month is healthy, much less safe.
11-01-2022 | 06:57 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,033
Likes: 0
To do over $300K as a FO in your fifth year at SWA means you average at least $25K per month. The current pay per TFP for a fifth year FO is $147.50.
Unless StayFrosty is including the B-Fund and profit sharing as part of that “over $300K” fifth year FO compensation figure, that means you’d have to credit very close to 170 TFP per month, every month, as a fifth year FO to bring in that kind of income.
That’s 17 days of work every month at an average of 10 TFP per day. The typical line here works 12-14 days per month. The typical duty day probably pays about 7.5 to 8 TFP at straight pay. My rule of thumb is that I won’t pick up an extra day of flying for less than 10 TFP per day, which means I won’t fly extra unless it pays premium.
In my base, very senior in my seat position, it’s unfeasible for me to average 10 TFP per day because it’s nearly impossible to get rid of enough straight days of flying to raise my average TFP per day above 10. The only months where I’m nearly guaranteed to be able to do that is when I have at least one week of vacation in that month.
StayFrosty’s math would necessitate flying a normal line’s worth of flying (in terms of number of days of flying) plus at least an extra 3-5 days per month and flying all of those days at premium pay.
Or maybe StayFrosty gets a line each month that averages 12 days. He/she is able to give away a couple of those days. My experience recently, as a very senior pilot, is that I can reliably give away about two days of flying per month. I haven’t had much luck being able to give away more days than that in a month. Often, I’ll have turns paying 9+ that don’t get picked up from give away.
So, let’s say StayFrosty gives away two days of flying each month to bring him/her down to ten days of straight flying per month. That puts him her at about 77.5 TFP. To get up to 170 TFP for the month would require flying an extra nine days, all at premium pay. That’s 19 days of flying for the month, which some people don’t mind doing. But then the problem becomes finding enough premium flying days that don’t take you over the block time limitations for the month. Not impossible but it’s difficult. Maybe that’s how he/she does it. I don’t know.
It could be that StayFrosty is in one of our “cartels” (I’m not) or has some other way to consistently fly all or nearly all of his/her days at premium pay, but to suggest that it is doable to consistently fly 170-ish TFP month-in and month-out as a normal fifth year line pilot without some extra help to clear straight-pay days from his/her board is a major stretch.
I’m not saying it’s not doable, but if you’re going to be able to do it, you’re probably going to need help in the form of a cartel, a military reserve or Guard job (to be able to drop mil leave and help clear your board), work for SWAPA (to help clear your board with trip drops), some kind of company special projects or flight ops job (to be able to drop trips), or some kind of something that allows you to clear your board way beyond what the average pilot is able to do via TTGA or ELITT. And I’m not sure that any of those options I just listed beyond being in a cartel would allow you to consistently credit over 170 TFP per month.
Unless StayFrosty is including the B-Fund and profit sharing as part of that “over $300K” fifth year FO compensation figure, that means you’d have to credit very close to 170 TFP per month, every month, as a fifth year FO to bring in that kind of income.
That’s 17 days of work every month at an average of 10 TFP per day. The typical line here works 12-14 days per month. The typical duty day probably pays about 7.5 to 8 TFP at straight pay. My rule of thumb is that I won’t pick up an extra day of flying for less than 10 TFP per day, which means I won’t fly extra unless it pays premium.
In my base, very senior in my seat position, it’s unfeasible for me to average 10 TFP per day because it’s nearly impossible to get rid of enough straight days of flying to raise my average TFP per day above 10. The only months where I’m nearly guaranteed to be able to do that is when I have at least one week of vacation in that month.
StayFrosty’s math would necessitate flying a normal line’s worth of flying (in terms of number of days of flying) plus at least an extra 3-5 days per month and flying all of those days at premium pay.
Or maybe StayFrosty gets a line each month that averages 12 days. He/she is able to give away a couple of those days. My experience recently, as a very senior pilot, is that I can reliably give away about two days of flying per month. I haven’t had much luck being able to give away more days than that in a month. Often, I’ll have turns paying 9+ that don’t get picked up from give away.
So, let’s say StayFrosty gives away two days of flying each month to bring him/her down to ten days of straight flying per month. That puts him her at about 77.5 TFP. To get up to 170 TFP for the month would require flying an extra nine days, all at premium pay. That’s 19 days of flying for the month, which some people don’t mind doing. But then the problem becomes finding enough premium flying days that don’t take you over the block time limitations for the month. Not impossible but it’s difficult. Maybe that’s how he/she does it. I don’t know.
It could be that StayFrosty is in one of our “cartels” (I’m not) or has some other way to consistently fly all or nearly all of his/her days at premium pay, but to suggest that it is doable to consistently fly 170-ish TFP month-in and month-out as a normal fifth year line pilot without some extra help to clear straight-pay days from his/her board is a major stretch.
I’m not saying it’s not doable, but if you’re going to be able to do it, you’re probably going to need help in the form of a cartel, a military reserve or Guard job (to be able to drop mil leave and help clear your board), work for SWAPA (to help clear your board with trip drops), some kind of company special projects or flight ops job (to be able to drop trips), or some kind of something that allows you to clear your board way beyond what the average pilot is able to do via TTGA or ELITT. And I’m not sure that any of those options I just listed beyond being in a cartel would allow you to consistently credit over 170 TFP per month.
I am pretty senior as well, and this post is SPOT on.
I don't go for big trip totals, but I do try to get rid of as much straight flying as possible, and pick up premium to replace it. If am gonna be stuck in the reroute Vortex, I prefer to be making 1.5.
Getting rid of the straight flying is by far the hardest part.
I bid the fewest amount of days, preferably 12 or less weekday PM turns (the most likely trips to actually get picked up in giveaway) and always try to maximize overlap pull. After the overlap is pulled, I then trade back into the current month and try to break it up into the smallest, weekday chunks as I can, and all goes straight into TTGA.
Net zero has been a complete miss this summer. I've always been able to catch at least a day or 2 on the 25th before that, but nowadays, even with the trades pre selected and hitting it in less than a second, I miss them every time. I suspect that there are folks out there with some kind of app that automatically executes the down trades when DTC hits a positive.
Summer months, I am able to get rid of most of my straight flying and sometimes all of it, but it's a lot of work, and luck plays a lot into it wrt Net Zero, DTC and giveaways.
170-180 per month, every month is a lot of work, if you can even do it.
11-01-2022 | 06:58 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,264
Likes: 0
To me, that’s important because the implication that we can “easily” out-earn our peers at other airlines also carries with it a sort of insinuation that we don’t really need that much better of a contract because, if you work 18+ days per month and expend much of your off-duty psychic energy orchestrating the pulling off of 170+ TFP month-in and month-out, your W2 can be bigger than a line guy at Delta or FedEx working half as hard as you.
11-01-2022 | 09:38 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,033
Likes: 0
To me, the value of these sorts of threads lies in debunking the idea that it’s “easy” to consistently score the 170 TFP and above monthly trip totals at SWA as a typical line pilot. It seems like a lot of our SWA guys like to casually throw those sorts of “easy” numbers out on threads for whatever reason, but when you get down to the brass tacks of how they actually do it, their story starts to unravel a bit.
To me, that’s important because the implication that we can “easily” out-earn our peers at other airlines also carries with it a sort of insinuation that we don’t really need that much better of a contract because, if you work 18+ days per month and expend much of your off-duty psychic energy orchestrating the pulling off of 170+ TFP month-in and month-out, your W2 can be bigger than a line guy at Delta or FedEx working half as hard as you.
To me, that’s important because the implication that we can “easily” out-earn our peers at other airlines also carries with it a sort of insinuation that we don’t really need that much better of a contract because, if you work 18+ days per month and expend much of your off-duty psychic energy orchestrating the pulling off of 170+ TFP month-in and month-out, your W2 can be bigger than a line guy at Delta or FedEx working half as hard as you.
The gap widens even more when your peers at OALs start holding widebodies.
11-01-2022 | 01:46 PM
#39
Spikes the Koolaid
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 435
Likes: 16
From: 737
To me, the value of these sorts of threads lies in debunking the idea that it’s “easy” to consistently score the 170 TFP and above monthly trip totals at SWA as a typical line pilot. It seems like a lot of our SWA guys like to casually throw those sorts of “easy” numbers out on threads for whatever reason, but when you get down to the brass tacks of how they actually do it, their story starts to unravel a bit.
To me, that’s important because the implication that we can “easily” out-earn our peers at other airlines also carries with it a sort of insinuation that we don’t really need that much better of a contract because, if you work 18+ days per month and expend much of your off-duty psychic energy orchestrating the pulling off of 170+ TFP month-in and month-out, your W2 can be bigger than a line guy at Delta or FedEx working half as hard as you.
To me, that’s important because the implication that we can “easily” out-earn our peers at other airlines also carries with it a sort of insinuation that we don’t really need that much better of a contract because, if you work 18+ days per month and expend much of your off-duty psychic energy orchestrating the pulling off of 170+ TFP month-in and month-out, your W2 can be bigger than a line guy at Delta or FedEx working half as hard as you.
You're getting 25% more because you're working 50% more.
Also, something to be reminded of: in order to realize these fat trips, etc, you must have an incredible working knowledge of the contract and audit every single trip you go on. I get over ten thousand dollars a year by re-auditing company audits that have been done incorrectly.
I should not have to work 50% more and do my own payroll to get 25% more than my peers just flying the line. But I guess that's too big for a picket sign
11-01-2022 | 05:56 PM
#40
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 210
Likes: 0
To do over $300K as a FO in your fifth year at SWA means you average at least $25K per month. The current pay per TFP for a fifth year FO is $147.50.
Unless StayFrosty is including the B-Fund and profit sharing as part of that “over $300K” fifth year FO compensation figure, that means you’d have to credit very close to 170 TFP per month, every month, as a fifth year FO to bring in that kind of income.
That’s 17 days of work every month at an average of 10 TFP per day. The typical line here works 12-14 days per month. The typical duty day probably pays about 7.5 to 8 TFP at straight pay. My rule of thumb is that I won’t pick up an extra day of flying for less than 10 TFP per day, which means I won’t fly extra unless it pays premium.
In my base, very senior in my seat position, it’s unfeasible for me to average 10 TFP per day because it’s nearly impossible to get rid of enough straight days of flying to raise my average TFP per day above 10. The only months where I’m nearly guaranteed to be able to do that is when I have at least one week of vacation in that month.
StayFrosty’s math would necessitate flying a normal line’s worth of flying (in terms of number of days of flying) plus at least an extra 3-5 days per month and flying all of those days at premium pay.
Or maybe StayFrosty gets a line each month that averages 12 days. He/she is able to give away a couple of those days. My experience recently, as a very senior pilot, is that I can reliably give away about two days of flying per month. I haven’t had much luck being able to give away more days than that in a month. Often, I’ll have turns paying 9+ that don’t get picked up from give away.
So, let’s say StayFrosty gives away two days of flying each month to bring him/her down to ten days of straight flying per month. That puts him her at about 77.5 TFP. To get up to 170 TFP for the month would require flying an extra nine days, all at premium pay. That’s 19 days of flying for the month, which some people don’t mind doing. But then the problem becomes finding enough premium flying days that don’t take you over the block time limitations for the month. Not impossible but it’s difficult. Maybe that’s how he/she does it. I don’t know.
It could be that StayFrosty is in one of our “cartels” (I’m not) or has some other way to consistently fly all or nearly all of his/her days at premium pay, but to suggest that it is doable to consistently fly 170-ish TFP month-in and month-out as a normal fifth year line pilot without some extra help to clear straight-pay days from his/her board is a major stretch.
I’m not saying it’s not doable, but if you’re going to be able to do it, you’re probably going to need help in the form of a cartel, a military reserve or Guard job (to be able to drop mil leave and help clear your board), work for SWAPA (to help clear your board with trip drops), some kind of company special projects or flight ops job (to be able to drop trips), or some kind of something that allows you to clear your board way beyond what the average pilot is able to do via TTGA or ELITT. And I’m not sure that any of those options I just listed beyond being in a cartel would allow you to consistently credit over 170 TFP per month.
Unless StayFrosty is including the B-Fund and profit sharing as part of that “over $300K” fifth year FO compensation figure, that means you’d have to credit very close to 170 TFP per month, every month, as a fifth year FO to bring in that kind of income.
That’s 17 days of work every month at an average of 10 TFP per day. The typical line here works 12-14 days per month. The typical duty day probably pays about 7.5 to 8 TFP at straight pay. My rule of thumb is that I won’t pick up an extra day of flying for less than 10 TFP per day, which means I won’t fly extra unless it pays premium.
In my base, very senior in my seat position, it’s unfeasible for me to average 10 TFP per day because it’s nearly impossible to get rid of enough straight days of flying to raise my average TFP per day above 10. The only months where I’m nearly guaranteed to be able to do that is when I have at least one week of vacation in that month.
StayFrosty’s math would necessitate flying a normal line’s worth of flying (in terms of number of days of flying) plus at least an extra 3-5 days per month and flying all of those days at premium pay.
Or maybe StayFrosty gets a line each month that averages 12 days. He/she is able to give away a couple of those days. My experience recently, as a very senior pilot, is that I can reliably give away about two days of flying per month. I haven’t had much luck being able to give away more days than that in a month. Often, I’ll have turns paying 9+ that don’t get picked up from give away.
So, let’s say StayFrosty gives away two days of flying each month to bring him/her down to ten days of straight flying per month. That puts him her at about 77.5 TFP. To get up to 170 TFP for the month would require flying an extra nine days, all at premium pay. That’s 19 days of flying for the month, which some people don’t mind doing. But then the problem becomes finding enough premium flying days that don’t take you over the block time limitations for the month. Not impossible but it’s difficult. Maybe that’s how he/she does it. I don’t know.
It could be that StayFrosty is in one of our “cartels” (I’m not) or has some other way to consistently fly all or nearly all of his/her days at premium pay, but to suggest that it is doable to consistently fly 170-ish TFP month-in and month-out as a normal fifth year line pilot without some extra help to clear straight-pay days from his/her board is a major stretch.
I’m not saying it’s not doable, but if you’re going to be able to do it, you’re probably going to need help in the form of a cartel, a military reserve or Guard job (to be able to drop mil leave and help clear your board), work for SWAPA (to help clear your board with trip drops), some kind of company special projects or flight ops job (to be able to drop trips), or some kind of something that allows you to clear your board way beyond what the average pilot is able to do via TTGA or ELITT. And I’m not sure that any of those options I just listed beyond being in a cartel would allow you to consistently credit over 170 TFP per month.
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