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Old 10-05-2015, 05:31 AM   #14071  
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Originally Posted by FlyingOkra View Post
But what is the Alternative to Transition? What do you see as an acceptable replacement or resolution.
Spread that cost out. There are Multiple ways, some of which........

Pay rate
Retirement
Vacation
Trip rig
Etc

Why keep a system that benefits such a small number of pilots and essentially costs everyone else by lost income that could be made by selling it.
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Old 10-05-2015, 06:01 AM   #14072  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyMeatballs View Post
Spread that cost out. There are Multiple ways, some of which........

Pay rate
Retirement
Vacation
Trip rig
Etc


Why keep a system that benefits such a small number of pilots and essentially costs everyone else by lost income that could be made by selling it.
I see what you plan on getting in return for giving up Transition, but not how you see Conflicts being resolved during Transition.

Drop w/ No Pay Protection?
Let them figure it out?
1 Off in 7, so that the end/beginning of every month is a terrible schedule?

Or do you only see $$$$$$$$$$
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Old 10-05-2015, 06:52 AM   #14073  
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Originally Posted by FlyingOkra View Post
I see what you plan on getting in return for giving up Transition, but not how you see Conflicts being resolved during Transition.

Drop w/ No Pay Protection?
Let them figure it out?
1 Off in 7, so that the end/beginning of every month is a terrible schedule?

Or do you only see $$$$$$$$$$
Sadly, I don't have answer for ya
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Old 10-05-2015, 07:02 AM   #14074  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyMeatballs View Post
Spread that cost out. There are Multiple ways, some of which........

Pay rate
Retirement
Vacation
Trip rig
Etc

Why keep a system that benefits such a small number of pilots and essentially costs everyone else by lost income that could be made by selling it.

Or we can we look at a different way.

The few (10-15%) that benefit directly from it do make more, but upward movement is also worth something and the majority of the list is still moving at a pretty decent clip.

So.... what's the effect on staffing? Is it the 'right' time to trade it for a few bucks ($15K per pilot, per year, is the number I've heard thrown out)?

Or should we wait for one more cycle???

Or based on FOkras' post, maybe never.

Last edited by putzin; 10-05-2015 at 07:14 AM.
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Old 10-05-2015, 07:07 AM   #14075  
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Originally Posted by JoeyMeatballs View Post
Sadly, I don't have answer for ya
Most people see Transition as a money grab, but it's really a QOL protection. We just turn it into a money grab, because we have **** pay rates. How do you guys see Transition playing out in the future without our current protections?

Remove without pay?

Let scheduling figure out how to make you legal?

1 Off in 7?

Guarantee 4 Days off?

These are things you really need to think about before chasing the dollars.
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Old 10-05-2015, 07:56 AM   #14076  
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As I have said earlier, we need a pay raise to bring us in line with our peers. There is no justification for giving up any of our work rules, period! Transition conflict language needs to remain!

We have some work rules that are better than the industry and have some that are worse than the industry. It averages out to close to industry standard. Many of you here on this board are willing to give up the good things in our contract to get what we would already have gotten. What do you propose we get in return, higher pay that we already are going to get?

Lets look at what we don't get that the industry gets. Premium pay for work on days off, premium pay for flying above guarantee, premium pay for red eye flying, getting paid out of the sick bank for lost trips via commuting, PROFIT SHARING CHECKS, PENSION PLAN, much better trips rigs and duty rigs, stronger language for scope.........

Lets not give up what we have and get nothing in return. The pay has to come giving a look at the equipment we fly and the profits the company makes. Stay strong and united as a pilot group.

Last edited by Green Giant; 10-05-2015 at 08:13 AM.
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Old 10-05-2015, 08:44 AM   #14077  
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But what is the Alternative to Transition? What do you see as an acceptable replacement or resolution.
How about NO alternative, NO replacement or resolution. Like you said earlier about chasing $$$ just look at American.
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Old 10-05-2015, 12:27 PM   #14078  
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Originally Posted by 8JRMfortheyear View Post
How about NO alternative, NO replacement or resolution. Like you said earlier about chasing $$$ just look at American.
That's exactly why I posed the question.
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Old 10-05-2015, 01:01 PM   #14079  
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Originally Posted by 8JRMfortheyear View Post
How about NO alternative, NO replacement or resolution. Like you said earlier about chasing $$$ just look at American.
You say look at AA, i'm genuinely asking because I don't know much about their work rules. What type of schedules do they have over there?
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Old 10-05-2015, 05:37 PM   #14080  
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Their work rules are basically part 117 limited. Currently line bid but will transition to pbs in the future. Hotels generally not as good as ours. Many of the work rules are regionalesque.

Although, best industry pay for most if not all equipment and a 16% if all wages retirement contribution. Do I want their contract? No, but $31k into my 401k every year does sound nice.
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