RAH Executive Board Election
10-06-2011, 12:57 PM
#1
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Posts: 63
RAH Executive Board Election
I read a few posts on another thread that supported the concept of having one or two Frontier Pilots on the Executive Board. I agree that nominating and electing a few Frontier pilots would be a step in the right direction towards building something that might actually work at this property.
Unfortunately, this doesn't appear to be possible. Here is why it will not happen.
The Local 357 claimed that they were going to delay the EBoard election until after the representation election in an effort to include the Frontier pilots.
The representation election ended on June 28th, the Frontier pilots received some membership information in late July and early August. To date, only a handful of Frontier pilots have actually joined as members. A number of pilots inquired about becoming agency fee payers and agency fee objectors. A number of pilots have since questioned the Local 357's computation of chargeable expenses. This process is still ongoing.
Since no one has joined, the IBT has not sent out ANY nomination/election information to the Frontier pilots. The nomination period has already started, and 16.C.2 and 16.C.3 of the Local 357 By-Laws state that a member is only eligible if they have continuous 24 months as a member in good standing.
I am confused how any of the Frontier pilots could have maintained 24 continuous months of membership in good standing if the election ended in June and no one was required to pay dues until August.
I am also disapointed that the IBT did not communicate any election information to any of the Frontier pilots . There was talk in early 2011 of a "Slate" that included some of the current Exco and some of the Frontier pilots. Apparently the IBT lost interest in this concept. There doesn't appear to be any real effort to "welcome" the new pilots from Frontier.
Even if a Frontier pilot joins and pays his due through September, he still can't be nominated per the Constitution and Bylaws.
Will the Local 357 Trustee grant an exception to the By-Laws or will the EBoard consist of seven Republic pilots and zero Frontier pilots?
On a related subject, the Local 357 has decided to conduct the E-Board Election via "mail-in Ballot". There is NO IBT requirement to use regular mail, nor does the Department of Labor require mail-in Ballots. In fact, most Unions use an online process. The following are some of the labor organizations use online ballots;
Airline Pilots Association (ALPA)
Association of Flight Attendants (AFA-CWA)
Frontier Airline Pilots Association (FAPA)
Independent Pilots Association (IPA)
National Pilots Association (NPA)
NetJet Association of Shared Aircraft Pilots (NetJet ASAP)
Southwest Airline Pilots Association (SWAPA)
Transport Workers Union Locals - Air Transport Division (TWU-ATD)
US Airline Pilots Association (USAPA)
Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association (AMFA)
Communications Workers of America (CWA)
International Union of Operating Engineers (IUOE)
National Mediation Board (NMB)
The benefits are obvious, online voting is easier for the individual members, and the voters can change their vote up until the close of the election. Using an online process greatly increases the number of members that participate. I can't think of a reason why the Local 357 has decided to use mail-in ballots, unless they would prefer a low percentage of participation versus a high percentage of participation.
On a seperate but related topic, why does the Airline Division have to have two Locals and two Executive Boards? One of the primary reasons the Frontier pilots have avoided membership is the apparent waste and bureaucracy of the IBT.
We have the Airline Division itself, functioning as the administrative/PR/lobbying arm of the aviation Locals. Then we have Local 1224 and Local 357 (Both of which are affiliated with two entirely different IBT Joint Councils).
Why not just have ONE Local, with ONE Executive Board? As an independant union advocate, I can't imagine the amount of money that is wasted here when you consider the overlapping roles and positions between all of these unnecesarry moving parts.
Looking from the outside in, it appears that the Local 357 pilots want to be seperate from the other IBT pilots due to the fact they were screwed by their previous Local 747 leadership. It also appears that the Local 1224 gents are happy being seperate with their Airborn Express led EBoard. I would think their experience and leadership would be a huge benefit to the Local 357 pilots.
I don't understand the need for all of these layers, seperations and divisions especially when you consider the overall group itself claims to be wanting "one-ness".
In summary, the E-Board election at RAH is really just a "renaming" of the current Exco. There will not be any "outsiders" involved unless the Trustee decides to allow their participation.
Additionally, I think the IBT would be better served with ONE "Super-E-Board", with one or two representative from every certificate represented by the IBT. The result would be a more efficient, effective, transparent, and unified airline division.
Do any of the IBT members think the Airline Division structure is the best concept available?
Do any of the Local 357 members want one or two Frontier Pilots to be nominated?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
Mike
Unfortunately, this doesn't appear to be possible. Here is why it will not happen.
The Local 357 claimed that they were going to delay the EBoard election until after the representation election in an effort to include the Frontier pilots.
The representation election ended on June 28th, the Frontier pilots received some membership information in late July and early August. To date, only a handful of Frontier pilots have actually joined as members. A number of pilots inquired about becoming agency fee payers and agency fee objectors. A number of pilots have since questioned the Local 357's computation of chargeable expenses. This process is still ongoing.
Since no one has joined, the IBT has not sent out ANY nomination/election information to the Frontier pilots. The nomination period has already started, and 16.C.2 and 16.C.3 of the Local 357 By-Laws state that a member is only eligible if they have continuous 24 months as a member in good standing.
I am confused how any of the Frontier pilots could have maintained 24 continuous months of membership in good standing if the election ended in June and no one was required to pay dues until August.
I am also disapointed that the IBT did not communicate any election information to any of the Frontier pilots . There was talk in early 2011 of a "Slate" that included some of the current Exco and some of the Frontier pilots. Apparently the IBT lost interest in this concept. There doesn't appear to be any real effort to "welcome" the new pilots from Frontier.
Even if a Frontier pilot joins and pays his due through September, he still can't be nominated per the Constitution and Bylaws.
Will the Local 357 Trustee grant an exception to the By-Laws or will the EBoard consist of seven Republic pilots and zero Frontier pilots?
On a related subject, the Local 357 has decided to conduct the E-Board Election via "mail-in Ballot". There is NO IBT requirement to use regular mail, nor does the Department of Labor require mail-in Ballots. In fact, most Unions use an online process. The following are some of the labor organizations use online ballots;
Airline Pilots Association (ALPA)
Association of Flight Attendants (AFA-CWA)
Frontier Airline Pilots Association (FAPA)
Independent Pilots Association (IPA)
National Pilots Association (NPA)
NetJet Association of Shared Aircraft Pilots (NetJet ASAP)
Southwest Airline Pilots Association (SWAPA)
Transport Workers Union Locals - Air Transport Division (TWU-ATD)
US Airline Pilots Association (USAPA)
Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association (AMFA)
Communications Workers of America (CWA)
International Union of Operating Engineers (IUOE)
National Mediation Board (NMB)
The benefits are obvious, online voting is easier for the individual members, and the voters can change their vote up until the close of the election. Using an online process greatly increases the number of members that participate. I can't think of a reason why the Local 357 has decided to use mail-in ballots, unless they would prefer a low percentage of participation versus a high percentage of participation.
On a seperate but related topic, why does the Airline Division have to have two Locals and two Executive Boards? One of the primary reasons the Frontier pilots have avoided membership is the apparent waste and bureaucracy of the IBT.
We have the Airline Division itself, functioning as the administrative/PR/lobbying arm of the aviation Locals. Then we have Local 1224 and Local 357 (Both of which are affiliated with two entirely different IBT Joint Councils).
Why not just have ONE Local, with ONE Executive Board? As an independant union advocate, I can't imagine the amount of money that is wasted here when you consider the overlapping roles and positions between all of these unnecesarry moving parts.
Looking from the outside in, it appears that the Local 357 pilots want to be seperate from the other IBT pilots due to the fact they were screwed by their previous Local 747 leadership. It also appears that the Local 1224 gents are happy being seperate with their Airborn Express led EBoard. I would think their experience and leadership would be a huge benefit to the Local 357 pilots.
I don't understand the need for all of these layers, seperations and divisions especially when you consider the overall group itself claims to be wanting "one-ness".
In summary, the E-Board election at RAH is really just a "renaming" of the current Exco. There will not be any "outsiders" involved unless the Trustee decides to allow their participation.
Additionally, I think the IBT would be better served with ONE "Super-E-Board", with one or two representative from every certificate represented by the IBT. The result would be a more efficient, effective, transparent, and unified airline division.
Do any of the IBT members think the Airline Division structure is the best concept available?
Do any of the Local 357 members want one or two Frontier Pilots to be nominated?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
Mike
10-06-2011, 03:03 PM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Eff Oh Won Fo Fife
Posts: 325
Originally Posted by RPC Unity
I read a few posts on another thread that supported the concept of having one or two Frontier Pilots on the Executive Board. I agree that nominating and electing a few Frontier pilots would be a step in the right direction towards building something that might actually work at this property.
Unfortunately, this doesn't appear to be possible. Here is why it will not happen.
The Local 357 claimed that they were going to delay the EBoard election until after the representation election in an effort to include the Frontier pilots.
The representation election ended on June 28th, the Frontier pilots received some membership information in late July and early August. To date, only a handful of Frontier pilots have actually joined as members. A number of pilots inquired about becoming agency fee payers and agency fee objectors. A number of pilots have since questioned the Local 357's computation of chargeable expenses. This process is still ongoing.
Since no one has joined, the IBT has not sent out ANY nomination/election information to the Frontier pilots.
Unfortunately, this doesn't appear to be possible. Here is why it will not happen.
The Local 357 claimed that they were going to delay the EBoard election until after the representation election in an effort to include the Frontier pilots.
The representation election ended on June 28th, the Frontier pilots received some membership information in late July and early August. To date, only a handful of Frontier pilots have actually joined as members. A number of pilots inquired about becoming agency fee payers and agency fee objectors. A number of pilots have since questioned the Local 357's computation of chargeable expenses. This process is still ongoing.
Since no one has joined, the IBT has not sent out ANY nomination/election information to the Frontier pilots.
From the NLRB website:
If you are not a member, you are still fully covered by the collective bargaining agreement that was negotiated between your employer and the union, and the union is obligated to represent you. Any benefits that are provided to you by your employer pursuant to the collective bargaining agreement (e.g., wages, seniority, vacations, pensions, health insurance)are not affected by your nonmembership. (If the union offers some "members-only" benefits, you might be excluded from receiving those.) If you are not a member, you may not be able to participate in union elections or meetings, vote in collective bargaining ratification elections, or participate in other "internal" union activities. However, you cannot be disciplined by the union for anything you do while not a member.
So, now you have turned 2/3 of your members into ineligible candidates/ voters.
Originally Posted by RPC Unity
The nomination period has already started, and 16.C.2 and 16.C.3 of the Local 357 By-Laws state that a member is only eligible if they have continuous 24 months as a member in good standing.
I am confused how any of the Frontier pilots could have maintained 24 continuous months of membership in good standing if the election ended in June and no one was required to pay dues until August.
I am confused how any of the Frontier pilots could have maintained 24 continuous months of membership in good standing if the election ended in June and no one was required to pay dues until August.
Article II Section 4 (4) (c). In newly chartered Local Unions, chartered as a result of split-off or merger, a candidate must be a member of the newly chartered Local Union, must have worked in the jurisdiction for a total period of two (2) years, and for a total period of twenty-four (24) consecutive months prior to nomination must be in continuous good standing on a cumulative basis in the newly chartered Local Union and the Local Union from which the newly chartered Local Union was split-off or with which the newly chartered Local Union was merged.
10-06-2011, 04:45 PM
#3
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Joined APC: May 2011
Posts: 63
Originally Posted by WeaselBoy
I heard that 2/3 of you all have decided to be non-union members. While the union is still required to administer your contract, it does not require the union to allow you to participate in elections.
From the NLRB website:
If you are not a member, you are still fully covered by the collective bargaining agreement that was negotiated between your employer and the union, and the union is obligated to represent you. Any benefits that are provided to you by your employer pursuant to the collective bargaining agreement (e.g., wages, seniority, vacations, pensions, health insurance)are not affected by your nonmembership. (If the union offers some "members-only" benefits, you might be excluded from receiving those.) If you are not a member, you may not be able to participate in union elections or meetings, vote in collective bargaining ratification elections, or participate in other "internal" union activities. However, you cannot be disciplined by the union for anything you do while not a member.
So, now you have turned 2/3 of your members into ineligible candidates/ voters.
From the IBT National Constitution:
Article II Section 4 (4) (c). In newly chartered Local Unions, chartered as a result of split-off or merger, a candidate must be a member of the newly chartered Local Union, must have worked in the jurisdiction for a total period of two (2) years, and for a total period of twenty-four (24) consecutive months prior to nomination must be in continuous good standing on a cumulative basis in the newly chartered Local Union and the Local Union from which the newly chartered Local Union was split-off or with which the newly chartered Local Union was merged.
From the NLRB website:
If you are not a member, you are still fully covered by the collective bargaining agreement that was negotiated between your employer and the union, and the union is obligated to represent you. Any benefits that are provided to you by your employer pursuant to the collective bargaining agreement (e.g., wages, seniority, vacations, pensions, health insurance)are not affected by your nonmembership. (If the union offers some "members-only" benefits, you might be excluded from receiving those.) If you are not a member, you may not be able to participate in union elections or meetings, vote in collective bargaining ratification elections, or participate in other "internal" union activities. However, you cannot be disciplined by the union for anything you do while not a member.
So, now you have turned 2/3 of your members into ineligible candidates/ voters.
From the IBT National Constitution:
Article II Section 4 (4) (c). In newly chartered Local Unions, chartered as a result of split-off or merger, a candidate must be a member of the newly chartered Local Union, must have worked in the jurisdiction for a total period of two (2) years, and for a total period of twenty-four (24) consecutive months prior to nomination must be in continuous good standing on a cumulative basis in the newly chartered Local Union and the Local Union from which the newly chartered Local Union was split-off or with which the newly chartered Local Union was merged.
With regard to your first point, everyone at Frontier understands the rules. I believe that less than 25 pilots have become IBT members. The remaining 675 understand what it means to not join the IBT. My point is that I believe the IBT should have done something more than simply send the Frontier pilots an invoice. If the IBT really and truly wanted Frontier pilot participation, they should have communicated the importance of the E-Board election process and communicated the "benefits" of becoming a member of the IBT.
When RAH has a newhire class, does the IBT visit the class and welcome them into the union or do they send them a folder with a bill? Why should the Frontier pilots be any different?
To your second point, I do not think Article IV applies to this situation. Was Local 357 "rechartered" on June 28th? Was FAPA a "Local" in the eyes of the IBT before June 28th? Even if it does apply, how do we reconcile the 24 continuous months requirement if no dues could have possibly been paid in July?
10-06-2011, 07:19 PM
#4
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Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Eff Oh Won Fo Fife
Posts: 325
Originally Posted by RPC Unity
If the IBT really and truly wanted Frontier pilot participation, they should have communicated the importance of the E-Board election process and communicated the "benefits" of becoming a member of the IBT.
Originally Posted by RPC Unity
To your second point, I do not think Article IV applies to this situation. Was Local 357 "rechartered" on June 28th? Was FAPA a "Local" in the eyes of the IBT before June 28th? Even if it does apply, how do we reconcile the 24 continuous months requirement if no dues could have possibly been paid in July?
If you want to remain a nonparticipant, than you have taken away any say on how things go forward from here.
10-06-2011, 08:53 PM
#5
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Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: EMB-145 CA
Posts: 456
this is not us trying to leave out the F9 guys, or anyone else for that matter. this your chance to get involved and move forward. Pay your dues, join the union and send in someone who's willing to help move forward rather than hold up everything. Maybe this will be the start of the F9 guys finally getting how this merger has worked, though I doubt it till it's over. I personally want one of you guys, one Lynx and one MEH guy on the board. We need a voice from everywhere. Step up guys. if you present yourself as a reasonable person who is interested in the betterment of everyone than you will get my support. Regardless of where you came from.
10-06-2011, 09:11 PM
#6
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Joined APC: Mar 2010
Posts: 387
Originally Posted by RPC Unity
On a related subject, the Local 357 has decided to conduct the E-Board Election via "mail-in Ballot". There is NO IBT requirement to use regular mail, nor does the Department of Labor require mail-in Ballots. In fact, most Unions use an online process. The following are some of the labor organizations use online ballots;
Airline Pilots Association (ALPA)
Association of Flight Attendants (AFA-CWA)
Frontier Airline Pilots Association (FAPA)
Independent Pilots Association (IPA)
National Pilots Association (NPA)
NetJet Association of Shared Aircraft Pilots (NetJet ASAP)
Southwest Airline Pilots Association (SWAPA)
Transport Workers Union Locals - Air Transport Division (TWU-ATD)
US Airline Pilots Association (USAPA)
Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association (AMFA)
Communications Workers of America (CWA)
International Union of Operating Engineers (IUOE)
National Mediation Board (NMB)
The benefits are obvious, online voting is easier for the individual members, and the voters can change their vote up until the close of the election. Using an online process greatly increases the number of members that participate. I can't think of a reason why the Local 357 has decided to use mail-in ballots, unless they would prefer a low percentage of participation versus a high percentage of participation.
Airline Pilots Association (ALPA)
Association of Flight Attendants (AFA-CWA)
Frontier Airline Pilots Association (FAPA)
Independent Pilots Association (IPA)
National Pilots Association (NPA)
NetJet Association of Shared Aircraft Pilots (NetJet ASAP)
Southwest Airline Pilots Association (SWAPA)
Transport Workers Union Locals - Air Transport Division (TWU-ATD)
US Airline Pilots Association (USAPA)
Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association (AMFA)
Communications Workers of America (CWA)
International Union of Operating Engineers (IUOE)
National Mediation Board (NMB)
The benefits are obvious, online voting is easier for the individual members, and the voters can change their vote up until the close of the election. Using an online process greatly increases the number of members that participate. I can't think of a reason why the Local 357 has decided to use mail-in ballots, unless they would prefer a low percentage of participation versus a high percentage of participation.
10-07-2011, 03:34 AM
#7
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Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Originally Posted by WeaselBoy
I'm assuming you have more time in the industry than I do. Do you really have to be told how important an election is? I would do everything in my power to get one of my pilots on the EXCO. 700 F9 votes (plus whatever you could pick up from the native RAH pilots) should be more than enough to get a guy/gal on the EXCO.
They have stated more than once that this article does apply. And I believe that they have also stated that July's dues won't be collected since it was a transition month from the NMB ruling (not sure, since quite frankly, it didn't affect me).
If you want to remain a nonparticipant, than you have taken away any say on how things go forward from here.
They have stated more than once that this article does apply. And I believe that they have also stated that July's dues won't be collected since it was a transition month from the NMB ruling (not sure, since quite frankly, it didn't affect me).
If you want to remain a nonparticipant, than you have taken away any say on how things go forward from here.
The rest of the story now leaks out. For all the yammering by RPC, F9, Fault and others, the fact is that they have been actively telling people not to join the union. They FORGOT to tell them that if you don't join, you don't get a right to vote or hold office.
And all that's the IBT's fault...yeah, right.
So once again, the "leadership" of FAPA has led the membership down the garden path. And on the other side, folks like slumav who are saying what others have said so well: join up...bring names of people who TRULY have your best interests at heart and we will help make them part of the leadership.
Sounds like a much better deal than what RPC has dealt.
10-07-2011, 04:40 AM
#8
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Joined APC: May 2011
Posts: 63
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
We have a WINNER!!!
The rest of the story now leaks out. For all the yammering by RPC, F9, Fault and others, the fact is that they have been actively telling people not to join the union. They FORGOT to tell them that if you don't join, you don't get a right to vote or hold office.
And all that's the IBT's fault...yeah, right.
So once again, the "leadership" of FAPA has led the membership down the garden path. And on the other side, folks like slumav who are saying what others have said so well: join up...bring names of people who TRULY have your best interests at heart and we will help make them part of the leadership.
Sounds like a much better deal than what RPC has dealt.
The rest of the story now leaks out. For all the yammering by RPC, F9, Fault and others, the fact is that they have been actively telling people not to join the union. They FORGOT to tell them that if you don't join, you don't get a right to vote or hold office.
And all that's the IBT's fault...yeah, right.
So once again, the "leadership" of FAPA has led the membership down the garden path. And on the other side, folks like slumav who are saying what others have said so well: join up...bring names of people who TRULY have your best interests at heart and we will help make them part of the leadership.
Sounds like a much better deal than what RPC has dealt.
FAPA reps asked the IBT about the 24 month issue earlier this year. This isn't something that just came up.
FAPA also held a membership meeting earlier this year, led by a labor attorney, educating the pilot group about the different scenarios.
My entire point with this thread is the fact that the IBT's actions speak louder than their words.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but your own Constitution and Bylaws prevent such participation.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but you fail to send out one piece of information to any Frontier pilot regarding the nomination and election.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but you decide to conduct the first ever RAH Executive Board election via regular mail. An airline with over one dozen pilot domiciles and multiple displacements happening right now, and you choose regular mail over online voting?
For a group that claims they want participation, they seem to be making it as difficult as possible to nominate, run, and vote.
ATC, you don't work here. Between the post above where you simply make sh1t up and your other posts applauding new Omni 777 pay rates that rival some regional jet pay rates, I am coming to the conclusion that your perspective is pretty useless.
10-07-2011, 04:58 AM
#9
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Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Originally Posted by RPC Unity
The "rest of the story" in the real world is a lot different than your imagination.
FAPA reps asked the IBT about the 24 month issue earlier this year. This isn't something that just came up.
FAPA also held a membership meeting earlier this year, led by a labor attorney, educating the pilot group about the different scenarios.
My entire point with this thread is the fact that the IBT's actions speak louder than their words.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but your own Constitution and Bylaws prevent such participation.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but you fail to send out one piece of information to any Frontier pilot regarding the nomination and election.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but you decide to conduct the first ever RAH Executive Board election via regular mail. An airline with over one dozen pilot domiciles and multiple displacements happening right now, and you choose regular mail over online voting?
For a group that claims they want participation, they seem to be making it as difficult as possible to nominate, run, and vote.
ATC, you don't work here. Between the post above where you simply make sh1t up and your other posts applauding new Omni 777 pay rates that rival some regional jet pay rates, I am coming to the conclusion that your perspective is pretty useless.
FAPA reps asked the IBT about the 24 month issue earlier this year. This isn't something that just came up.
FAPA also held a membership meeting earlier this year, led by a labor attorney, educating the pilot group about the different scenarios.
My entire point with this thread is the fact that the IBT's actions speak louder than their words.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but your own Constitution and Bylaws prevent such participation.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but you fail to send out one piece of information to any Frontier pilot regarding the nomination and election.
You say you want Frontier pilot participation, but you decide to conduct the first ever RAH Executive Board election via regular mail. An airline with over one dozen pilot domiciles and multiple displacements happening right now, and you choose regular mail over online voting?
For a group that claims they want participation, they seem to be making it as difficult as possible to nominate, run, and vote.
ATC, you don't work here. Between the post above where you simply make sh1t up and your other posts applauding new Omni 777 pay rates that rival some regional jet pay rates, I am coming to the conclusion that your perspective is pretty useless.
Yes, it's everyone elses fault. You don't join, yet it's the IBT's fault for not sending out nomination and election information to NON MEMBERS who can't vote because they haven't joined. You complain about a paper ballot process, yet don't disclose that the electronic balloting you mention is done by a company owned by the AFL-CIO...and there are questions about the security of their process. Funny...paper ballots were used for DECADES..and still are.
Actions DO speak louder than words. Your actions have been focused on doing everything possible to keep F9 pilots from getting involved and having a voice. And then complain because you don't have a voice.
So tell us...have YOU joined?
10-07-2011, 07:13 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2008
Posts: 879
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
....first contracts are the hardest. And that they either end up being pay OR work rules focused. It usually takes the second contract to close all the loopholes and get both.
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
The rest of the story now leaks out. For all the yammering by RPC, F9, Fault and others, the fact is that they have been actively telling people not to join the union. They FORGOT to tell them that if you don't join, you don't get a right to vote or hold office.
This seems to be an IBT habit - they just make stuff up, and if you they it long enough, they expect people to believe it. To be fair though, I guess it worked for them when they snowed you into thinking that you were better off sticking with the same union that signed off on a 4 year, $37 max pay scale for FO's, and doesn't have an IBT airline contract out there that is on par with the FAPA contract (our second one).
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
Actions DO speak louder than words. Your actions have been focused on doing everything possible to keep F9 pilots from getting involved and having a voice. And then complain because you don't have a voice.
So tell us...have YOU joined?
So tell us...have YOU joined?
Last edited by FAULTPUSH; 10-07-2011 at 07:43 AM.
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