8-F-12
09-02-2023 | 09:18 AM
#71
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this was covered by one of the TA FACT team members on another forum… almost all new hires will qualify… the type rating will occur when they attend their initial qual course. Once qualified in right seat they’ll fly and gain hours/experience until they hit the 350 hours in type minimum… then company can schedule for Captain upgrade in the same fleet and they’ll do full course all over again. Only thing that will disqualify a pilot “forced” into a captain new hire award is if they have documented substandard performance while trained in their initial FO qual course (short cycled, etc) after Indoc.
But it’s not what the language says. 121.436 requires a type rating and a new hire may not be assigned or awarded captain without meeting 121.436
09-02-2023 | 11:26 AM
#73
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Joined: May 2017
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From: Guppy
this was covered by one of the TA FACT team members on another forum… almost all new hires will qualify… the type rating will occur when they attend their initial qual course. Once qualified in right seat they’ll fly and gain hours/experience until they hit the 350 hours in type minimum… then company can schedule for Captain upgrade in the same fleet and they’ll do full course all over again. Only thing that will disqualify a pilot “forced” into a captain new hire award is if they have documented substandard performance while trained in their initial FO qual course (short cycled, etc) after Indoc.
The implementation of this will be a nightmare.
09-02-2023 | 12:39 PM
#74
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Joined: Jun 2007
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From: 767/757 CA
Interesting. I'm also curious what happens if they fail the upgrade class. They're off probation, but they don't have an FO award to fall back on. Do they just bid during the next vacancy bid at their seniority? What if there are no vacancy bids, do you just sit around, or can they fly you as an FO (will you be paid CA pay because your category is CA)? Can you "intentionally" have substandard performance to avoid being placed in an upgrade class? Can they abrogate seniority if the CA slots fall in the class to people who aren't qualified? I'm not trying to be obtuse here, I really think there are legitimate questions that aren't answered in the language.
The implementation of this will be a nightmare.
The implementation of this will be a nightmare.
09-02-2023 | 03:32 PM
#76
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09-02-2023 | 03:41 PM
#77
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You are absolutely right. Captains, LCP's, and Instructors are the biggest leverage (or only) we have now that the guvunment won't let us strike. For us to give up the only leverage we have, we should have gotten HUGE rewards in this TA.....like Delta++++. Instead we got Delta-.
09-02-2023 | 06:24 PM
#78
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,042
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From: 767/757 CA
probationary pilots don’t get to vote.
09-02-2023 | 07:44 PM
#79
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Joined: Aug 2021
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It's extremely disgusting that we're talking about this like it's all but settled, and the insult on top of the injury is we're still behind Delta in several places. We will never get the leverage back to negotiate quality of life or pay increases to widen the gulf between this and widebody first officer once we hand the company our newest and voiceless pilots on a platter.
Some people shouldn't be captain and some people choose to never be captain and as long as they're currently on property we fight to defend that choice. The aspiring United pilots are going to get ****ed to maintain our comfort.
Some people shouldn't be captain and some people choose to never be captain and as long as they're currently on property we fight to defend that choice. The aspiring United pilots are going to get ****ed to maintain our comfort.
09-02-2023 | 07:52 PM
#80
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Joined: Apr 2018
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Someone who doesn’t have the skill (potential) to be captain, shouldn’t hired in the first place and someone who doesn’t have the desire should be fired for being a slack ass who wants to put all the responsibility on the other person and just collect a check.
