that’s the way I understand it also… locked for 2 years.

 

So if someone comes in from mil or 135 without 121 experience (happening now) they could be frozen into an asap nbca bid for 2 years while they get 1000 hours 121 time and then locked into that seat for another 2 years?

 

No, lock starts from award.

 

Sounds like B scale mentality. “We’ll make things worse for the incoming pilots but it’s fine because it won’t hurt anyone currently on property & all the new guys will know what they’re getting themselves into.” Awesome.

 

This specific provision in the contract won't hurt anyone on/off the property... prospective hires will know the "rules" before accepting the CJO... if they don't like the "rules" then don't accept and go elsewhere as everyone is hiring. I think the real thorn in the side of many of the pilots on property is they don't like the idea of having to fly with a much more junior pilot who will be making all the decisions... remedy for that (and company knows it) is to bid over to the left seat. Like I said on another thread... this issue of having captain vacancies after a bid is going to dry up during the next economic downturn... this "rule" is never going to be implemented on a wide scale because many on property won't be here as they will be furloughed and the more senior pilots will be pushed down to either lower paying seats or take the NB upgrade. Hate to be the pessimist but I've personally experienced this problem 3 times during my time here. The explosive growth we are forecasting is awesome while its happening... but history shows it will turn sour.

 

the way I understand it, since this theoretical person got awarded CA during Indoc, if after training, and then building 1000 hours, and then going back through a full captain course took 2 years, you would never actually have to sit in the seat if you were able to bid something different in time.

 

“New hire and probationary pilots will be subject to section 8-F-12”. Would this apply to probationary pilots currently on property or only those hired after ratification? And am I correct that probies aren’t eligible to vote?

 

1. To be assigned one of these captain spots at indoc, they must already meet 121 requirements to hold captain. It said it cannot be assigned unless they do.

2. While freeze is active from award, the length of the freeze is essentially variable based on what I am reading is an “imputed activation date” and is based on when the person meets the 350 hrs in type at UA requirement.

 

If I’m reading 8-D-1-a-(3)-(a) correctly, forced upgrade “buy backs” are at the bottom of the priority list- not the top. So it only happens once all vacancies on a subsequent bid are filled and there are still senior pilots bidding upgrade over & beyond what was offered. The likelihood of one vacancy having unfilled CA seats, & then a sudden rush for the door a month later is not high, so I wouldn’t expect it to be common practice. Brickfire is right- this is designed to fill seats, not produce a revolving door.

 

yup. We don’t need to brief 400 miles from destination, and we don’t need to slow to 180kts 40 miles from TDZ….possum, or viper, or whoever you think you are.