I agree. I do think that much of what was written in the update was out of line. There were ways of putting management on notice without coming across as attacking the other pilot group who are now supposed to be on our side. This does a disservice to the combined pilot group as Jayson will have to work with UA reps on one combined MEC. The old saying goes "don't burn your bridges" but this wreaks of burning the bridge before you even get to cross it.

I ran into a rep from one of the other bases (domiciles now?). There was a discussion about the rumored egos on both sides of the table when the MECs met. Very general comments and nothing specific in saying "we are pilots and we feel passionately about our side, our view and our airline." When pressed for more specifics, this rep took the high road and said essentially that the discussions are better left in the room to be hammered out between the MECs and not aired for all, especially management, to see. In the end it was felt that we will all come together and unify and that these are just "growing" pains as each side feels the other out on their positions. I actually liked that specifics weren't given since I want our MECs to view management as the opposing side, not each other.

 

Please don't slam the guy. He said he didn't know if an answer to why the UAL seniority list showed guys staffed on the 737 had be received. He wasn't "dropping bombs" as you say. A little background on why he wondered:

Around the seniority list exchange time, we had some LEC meetings at CAL. People asked what was going on with the SLI talks and where we stood. The pilots were told the lists had been exchanged and we were in the information gathering stage so that both sides could understand the lists, ask any questions and answer any questions. For the most part, the exchange was straight forward, but that our side had some questions for when the committees got together again about the information on the list. When asked, the example that was given was that the UA seniority list shows pilots on the 737 when the 737 is no longer on property there. The committee would be asking their UA counterparts why that was at their next meeting to ask/answer questions.

Nothing sinister about that. From the couple of answers above, it appears there is a logical answer based in information that the committee didn't have. No harm, no foul. I'm sure they met, asked the question, it was answered and moved on. Just like I'm sure the UA guys had questions about our list.

 

Well, the message wasn't particularly helpful, but I'm sure there will be posturing on both sides with so much at stake. Importantly, it would be best to keep those things out of the public eye and show unity on all fronts. At the end of the day, I'm quite happy with the overall show of solidarity on both sides, from MECs and line pilots alike. Let's do our best to put these unfortunate moments behind us and move forward towards our ultimate goal of a great JCBA and a healthy airline.

We certainly will have our bloopers at UAL as well.

 

Calm down mate. I am the last person to drop bombs. The fact is it your merger committee was not clear about the answer to this basic question. And yes our merger head was annoyed with the delay, but we all have moved on. Confusion of who is on the list is the last thing we need to be dealing with. In the end it's really small potatoes so I apologize if my question p!ssed you off.

You took what I said completely out of context. As you said, there are @ssholes on both sides of this merger. Never once did I say I thought that it was some organized movement by UAL reps. I don't why JB got into grandstanding nor do I think there is a place for it. All I was doing was speculating as to a possible reason for the tone. Again sorry that p!ssed you off. JB's position is certainly not CAL ALPA's position. That last thing I do is 'spin'.

Okay then I could bring up the 'creative hiring' of the 90's which you counter with New York Air heroes. I bring up bending over on scope in BK and you counter with coach rest seat while not in BK. Yadda, yadda, yadda... Only winners in that bullsh!t are Glenn and Jeff. Hopefully both are groups are intelligent enough to figure that out fast.

There is plenty of garbage in both our closets, but I've got 30+ years to hopefully look forward to rather then dwell upon. Rather then berate me, why not PM Jayson right here or better yet start a thread demanding an explanation for the divisive message. Here's his profile on this very website:

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/members/cal-ewr.html

 

It looks like the horse is dead already.

Birdman
BTV

 

When I read this crap from an MEC rep, the more I advocate fences. Big ones for at least 10 years ala NW/Repub.

Fence off fleet/seat/domicile!

 

You asked in the earlier post why we have guys with 737 fleet assignments. The question was answered here, but the above indicates that you knew the answer before you asked the question. I mean I don't think that the postings here were delivered to the merger committee today to answer the burning question. This doesn't add up and it now does appear you were trying to post some inflammatory comments.

Look, I didn't want the merger either. However, it is here and it is now. We either get together and pull on the same end of the rope or we wind up like those knuckleheads at US Air. I call my reps and ask them to stay on the high road reference the tantrum thrown by Jayson. Maybe you guys could do the same.

L

 

Actually I never heard how the discrepancy was worked out. Quite frankly I forgot about it and didn't recall the issue until today. There are a lot better things to do in life then follow the day to day bs of a merger. I guess the question I asked today was answered months ago. Stupid me. So despite my previous apology for the misunderstanding, go ahead and take what I said as inflammatory. Only battle I am ready to fight is with Sismek, not you or a LEC rep...

 

The same here, but for different reasons. I don't approve of the public comments of one lec against another. But I don't care that he mentions the positives of cal in the integration. Do you all really think it's not being hammered out just like that in negotiations? What is wrong saying that cal has the massive presence in the world's largest population center? I'm sorry he didn't recognize uals hold on Denver as was posted earliar. I haven't posted much so the kumbaya can chant on, but this is a business. We have a ton of ****ed off pilots and I have no problem with a guy from jersey rallying the troops like union guys from jersey do. I'm sorry you guys don't like it, but until we have a sLi and jcba then I am still in one part of this group of cal guys. And I want my guys busting ass to get me the best deal possible. And just as many ual guys on this forum have opinions that sound ridiculous to cal guys. For instance referencing how good you and your contract was a decade ago and the implications of that or ratio of widebodies now that you guys lost scope. We laugh about that but ual guys get fired up. "don't say we have old airplanes, don't say we have miserable morale and customer service...". I'm getting a little fed up with the group hug stuff. I hold zero animosity towards any ual guy and I agree we must fight together force jcba. But the comments about our scabs when y'all have plenty also is just naive. If you want to talk about a napoleon complex, take a look at how every positive post about cal is taken as some sort of implied bash of ual. We are independent contractors til we are operationally merged. If you all are so worried about our group fighting tooth and nail for every seniority spot, then you better call your negotiators and tell them to step up their aggressiveness because I guarantee our guys are fighting like hell. And if I was on your side, I'd be upset if my group wasn't fighting that way. I'm not going to be flamed for not patting everyone on the ass here or not promoting unity. We are the ones that have to go to work and say calxxx in united livery, take pictures in front of our airplanes before they say united on them,have to tell people it's ok when they say sorry to hear about the end of continental, or hear jokes about how the service will deteriorate to a ual level now. Those are facts. That is the report from the line. I will be a united pilot when I have a number on the list, a jcba and a united callsign. Until then I want my guys fighting for me. Just as i assume you want. And I don't apologize for saying us, our, united or cal. That is needed for clarity. Let's all keep the napoleon complexes in check on both sides. Cal was in great shape with a great fleet and healthy, growing and advancing it's employees. There is nothing to apologize for there and that doesn't make this a post of ours is bigger. You all have plenty to be proud of too. But right now we each have negotiators busting their butts for our individual butts. And I wouldn't have it any other way. Time to be big boys and not be so sensitive. Oh yeah, kumbaya. Let's see how much kumbaya there is if the list doesn't go the way y'all want. We all are fighting for what we feel is right. Or at least supporting those who are fighting for us. . Be proud of your side and fight like hell for your seniority number. Cheers. And this post wasn't a response totally to the quoted pilot and typed on iPhone

 

You are spot on.

Lee