Cal mec special update (scope)
11-11-2010, 12:45 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Posts: 165
Originally Posted by TEXASTONE
The current CALMEC chairman may not have been a scab but, from what I have been told we ought not completely trust him.
First, he was an expressjet flowthru. Nothing wrong with that but, he had previously GIVEN UP his CAL seniority number to stay in MANAGEMENT at EXPRESSJET. When that turned south he begged for his number back at CAL and who gave it back....F Abbott. Can you or I do the same today? Give up our number, fly for SWA and get it back post-contract?
Also, did he not have a big role in selling this pilot group up the river during CO "02. Wasn't he and Goat Boy responsible, among others for this excuse for a contract.
Additionally, look at his current behavior in regards to trying to take down the IAH reps. So he decides to do this immediately AFTER he is passed up for Vice Chairman at National. JP is out for himself not the pilot group. Look at his past actions and decide for yourself. I have talked to many pilots that believe a screw-job contract proposal is coming our way. JP does not want to come back to the line. He was given the no thanks from Alpa N. You bet UAL management is where he is setting his sights.
be careful, be informed
First, he was an expressjet flowthru. Nothing wrong with that but, he had previously GIVEN UP his CAL seniority number to stay in MANAGEMENT at EXPRESSJET. When that turned south he begged for his number back at CAL and who gave it back....F Abbott. Can you or I do the same today? Give up our number, fly for SWA and get it back post-contract?
Also, did he not have a big role in selling this pilot group up the river during CO "02. Wasn't he and Goat Boy responsible, among others for this excuse for a contract.
Additionally, look at his current behavior in regards to trying to take down the IAH reps. So he decides to do this immediately AFTER he is passed up for Vice Chairman at National. JP is out for himself not the pilot group. Look at his past actions and decide for yourself. I have talked to many pilots that believe a screw-job contract proposal is coming our way. JP does not want to come back to the line. He was given the no thanks from Alpa N. You bet UAL management is where he is setting his sights.
be careful, be informed
Well said, It was done at UAL exactly like youre talking about, a guy named FERG ,was before my time though.
Senior guys please remind us of the details if you could.
Thanks
11-11-2010, 01:14 PM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Capt. B737
Posts: 329
The current CALMEC chairman may not have been a scab but, from what I have been told we ought not completely trust him.
At this point....I think the bigger fish to fry lies far beyond the CALMEC Chairman. I'd like to know who's advising Smizek on pilot contract loopholes.
I know his legal background....but I suspect he's getting input from flt. ops too. I just finished re-reading section 1. It looks clear to me that the contract stays as is until the JCBA or SLI....which ever is the latest. If Mgt. does have a loophole, but chose now to exploit it, it would seem more like provocation to me.
Last edited by Daytripper; 11-11-2010 at 01:26 PM.
11-11-2010, 03:47 PM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Posts: 169
Originally Posted by Daytripper
Where do you get your information? If you are refering to the CALMEC Chairman, 1989 would be his hire date. While he has fallen out of favor over seeking a national seat........I'm not aware of him crossing a picket line or flying struck work.
11-11-2010, 03:50 PM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Posts: 169
Originally Posted by TEXASTONE
The current CALMEC chairman may not have been a scab but, from what I have been told we ought not completely trust him.
First, he was an expressjet flowthru. Nothing wrong with that but, he had previously GIVEN UP his CAL seniority number to stay in MANAGEMENT at EXPRESSJET. When that turned south he begged for his number back at CAL and who gave it back....F Abbott. Can you or I do the same today? Give up our number, fly for SWA and get it back post-contract?
Also, did he not have a big role in selling this pilot group up the river during CO "02. Wasn't he and Goat Boy responsible, among others for this excuse for a contract.
Additionally, look at his current behavior in regards to trying to take down the IAH reps. So he decides to do this immediately AFTER he is passed up for Vice Chairman at National. JP is out for himself not the pilot group. Look at his past actions and decide for yourself. I have talked to many pilots that believe a screw-job contract proposal is coming our way. JP does not want to come back to the line. He was given the no thanks from Alpa N. You bet UAL management is where he is setting his sights.
be careful, be informed
First, he was an expressjet flowthru. Nothing wrong with that but, he had previously GIVEN UP his CAL seniority number to stay in MANAGEMENT at EXPRESSJET. When that turned south he begged for his number back at CAL and who gave it back....F Abbott. Can you or I do the same today? Give up our number, fly for SWA and get it back post-contract?
Also, did he not have a big role in selling this pilot group up the river during CO "02. Wasn't he and Goat Boy responsible, among others for this excuse for a contract.
Additionally, look at his current behavior in regards to trying to take down the IAH reps. So he decides to do this immediately AFTER he is passed up for Vice Chairman at National. JP is out for himself not the pilot group. Look at his past actions and decide for yourself. I have talked to many pilots that believe a screw-job contract proposal is coming our way. JP does not want to come back to the line. He was given the no thanks from Alpa N. You bet UAL management is where he is setting his sights.
be careful, be informed
11-11-2010, 04:43 PM
#35
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: e190
Posts: 929
Originally Posted by JoeMerchant
There is no contract violation here. CAL has been putting the CAL code on Mesa and Skywest 70 and 90 seaters for quite a while now....
11-12-2010, 06:39 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Position: A320/A319/B737 Sys Acft Maint Controller
Posts: 303
Originally Posted by SKMarz
Ah, it seems the "new United" is drawing from Tilton's play book. Let's hope legal recourse works. Unfortunately, hard won experience would suggest that management's 'alternate reality' of the CBA will become reality. Just look at the recent decision regarding Aer Lingus.
These "Tilton Plays" as you call them are going to be "Standard Issues" as far as the company is concerned. And If you delay in getting on a single seniority list? They'll become Standard FACT. as they have Nothing to Lose from a divided workforce of pilots. What Actually CAN you Negotiate?? As long as the rest of the SOC is in place and you're the Odd Men Out? They'll Do as they Please until there's Not enough money in the ALPA Coffers to Pay Lawyers. Take this to court for Sure but unless it's Negotiated away?
This is what you will see for the forseeable future. I don't know How the management was at CAL but United Managment isn't afraid if ALPA ONE IOTA and they Don't MIND dragging ALPA into court. Ask any of your UAL ALPA Brothers if this isn't true..
11-12-2010, 06:50 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: Cap. 737
Posts: 293
Originally Posted by strfyr51
************************************************** ********
These "Tilton Plays" as you call them are going to be "Standard Issues" as far as the company is concerned. And If you delay in getting on a single seniority list? They'll become Standard FACT. as they have Nothing to Lose from a divided workforce of pilots. What Actually CAN you Negotiate?? As long as the rest of the SOC is in place and you're the Odd Men Out? They'll Do as they Please until there's Not enough money in the ALPA Coffers to Pay Lawyers. Take this to court for Sure but unless it's Negotiated away?
This is what you will see for the forseeable future. I don't know How the management was at CAL but United Managment isn't afraid if ALPA ONE IOTA and they Don't MIND dragging ALPA into court. Ask any of your UAL ALPA Brothers if this isn't true..
These "Tilton Plays" as you call them are going to be "Standard Issues" as far as the company is concerned. And If you delay in getting on a single seniority list? They'll become Standard FACT. as they have Nothing to Lose from a divided workforce of pilots. What Actually CAN you Negotiate?? As long as the rest of the SOC is in place and you're the Odd Men Out? They'll Do as they Please until there's Not enough money in the ALPA Coffers to Pay Lawyers. Take this to court for Sure but unless it's Negotiated away?
This is what you will see for the forseeable future. I don't know How the management was at CAL but United Managment isn't afraid if ALPA ONE IOTA and they Don't MIND dragging ALPA into court. Ask any of your UAL ALPA Brothers if this isn't true..
Being furloughed, I don't have any say in what is going on. Personally, I think the standoff between the two MECs is pure insanity. The few points of leverage the pilot groups have are being foolishly thrown away. As far as I'm concerned, BOTH MECs are equally guilty. I don't trust ALPA, I don't trust the MECs but I'm not holding the cards and according to lots of folks on this site, when the music stops, the furloughees should take whatever seat they can find at the kid's table.
As I've said in previous posts, this merger is not going to resemble Delta/Northwest but it's starting to look a lot like another company that starts with the letter U.....
11-12-2010, 07:28 AM
#38
On Reserve
Joined APC: Nov 2010
Posts: 11
Originally Posted by TEXASTONE
Additionally, look at his current behavior in regards to trying to take down the IAH reps.
It's no excuse for his poor decision to run for the national position but I think he finally just got tired of their shix.
11-12-2010, 07:35 AM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Posts: 111
Originally Posted by Captain X
If you actually believe the two sitting IAH reps aren't deeply complicit in the recent goings-on you are a damn fool. They have had a personal vendetta and agenda against the sitting MEC Chair before they ever took office.
It's no excuse for his poor decision to run for the national position but I think he finally just got tired of their shix.
It's no excuse for his poor decision to run for the national position but I think he finally just got tired of their shix.
But on another note, you all that think NW/DAL was just a walk in the park and a bunch of high fives and ass slapping are high.
We are in the middle of merging into the largest airline on the planet and you dont think there will be a few months of hiccups? How naive.
Our little bickerings about banded rates etc are nothing compared to what fight we will have with the new Lorenzo. From the first second of Smallzdik saying labor is not a factor to pushing the scope to DefCon three status in two months of the merger shows how this will go down. Its easy to say CALs MEC is at fault, but I value those opinions as much as my kid's on the subject. Lots of armchair lawyers with no inside information and the creation of 'facts' based on personal biases about what 'should' be fair.
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