CAL Pilots lawsuit
08-05-2016 | 05:32 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,034
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Sorry, my bad- you are abolutely correct. In my tiny mind I was confusing the first contract (Contract '95) with the ALPA merger. Still not too sure how many from the L-CAL bottom third of the list were at Express at the time but it's obviously more than in my erroneous post.
08-05-2016 | 08:58 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2008
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Rumor is the release of the American Airlines seniority list is imminent.
Me thinks the resulting melee will make our spats or perceived wrongs look like a church bake sale in comparison.
Grab the popcorn boys and girls. It's guaranteed to be a hell of a show.
Me thinks the resulting melee will make our spats or perceived wrongs look like a church bake sale in comparison.
Grab the popcorn boys and girls. It's guaranteed to be a hell of a show.
08-05-2016 | 10:42 AM
#23
(retired)
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 422
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From: Old, retired, healthy, debt-free, liquid
I never held much credence in the suit to begin with. I knew a long time ago when I heard the ALPA lawyers tell pilots to their faces that it was OK and legal for ALPA to use ALPA moneys to represent and negotiate on behalf of regional carriers who were going after our scope clauses, our routes, and our revenue streams and ultimately our livelihoods and incomes that internal conflicts of interest exist within ALPA and they are sort of danced around, not talked about publicly, and on their face unethical, but are entirely legal. Therefore, I knew then that ALPA was under no legally compelling or binding way obligated to be "fair" (whatever that really means) as it relates to a merger process.
The real lesson here goes back to when ALPA was courting Continental and kept pushing it's public version of their ultra-cool and ultra-"fair" merger policy and the ALPA tool box. ALPA didn't make any references to what it deemed as a "fair process" to the CAL pilots and really the vote to join ALPA was going to fail unless ALPA was successful in winning over the CAL Express pilots. Without their votes the entire CAL going back to ALPA would have failed. So, likely it was those former express pilots that feel "jipped" the most. They bought it hook, line, and sinker and feel like ALPA lied to them in the "courting process." That's just how they feel. But, remember this, if it wasn't for them and their votes to join ALPA in the first place, we wouldn't even be having this virtual discussion on fair and equitable, for the ALPA policy manual, and the differences between the two CAL ALPA and UAL ALPA policy manuals would be a moot point.
The real lesson here goes back to when ALPA was courting Continental and kept pushing it's public version of their ultra-cool and ultra-"fair" merger policy and the ALPA tool box. ALPA didn't make any references to what it deemed as a "fair process" to the CAL pilots and really the vote to join ALPA was going to fail unless ALPA was successful in winning over the CAL Express pilots. Without their votes the entire CAL going back to ALPA would have failed. So, likely it was those former express pilots that feel "jipped" the most. They bought it hook, line, and sinker and feel like ALPA lied to them in the "courting process." That's just how they feel. But, remember this, if it wasn't for them and their votes to join ALPA in the first place, we wouldn't even be having this virtual discussion on fair and equitable, for the ALPA policy manual, and the differences between the two CAL ALPA and UAL ALPA policy manuals would be a moot point.
I was an elected official at the time and remember it well.
08-05-2016 | 10:50 AM
#24
Banned
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,655
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From: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Which will be the bigger show?
08-06-2016 | 05:23 PM
#26
Line Holder
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: B737 CA
This ex-CAL pilot did not donate nor agree with the suit. Time to move on. Now if only the military pilots' suit could be thrown out as well (on mil leave but wanted signing bonus back in 2012),we might have a chance at recovering the last 5% of the signing bonus owed to those of us actively working through the merger of these two airlines.
When will we ever get our money these *********s are blocking? Minus 4 years of interest of course......This is beyond ridiculous.
08-07-2016 | 05:22 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 332
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Don't you know it's unpatriotic to even question their motives? Next downturn/displacement/furlough, these same coworkers will bug out like a guy I know personally did in 2008 with this remark :"no reserve for me; I'll be back when things get better" . Unfortunately the ones who abuse military leave (always have it on 4th of July weekend/Thanksgiving etc leaving the rest of us to bid in PBS knowing there is no chance in Hell of getting a holiday off) make the vast majority of good military/United pilots look bad.
08-08-2016 | 06:49 AM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,159
Likes: 1
I disagree. I think the express pilots votes were key to putting it over the edge, and over the top, and putting the union on the map. Furthermore, I feel the express pilots did allot of heavy lifting in that union and did it on the cheap. It was the express pilots who taught the CAL pilots what unity and solidarity were all about. CAL pilots only knew about those things from books. We actually had express pilots mentoring the CAL pilots in terms of what a union is and what it should be doing.
08-08-2016 | 06:52 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,159
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The CAL MEC should have been observing USSERA law. Someone at National should have had their eye on the CAL MEC and their unique interpretation of Federal law as it pertains to benefit plans and military leave. You want your money? ALPA National should get a phone call.
08-08-2016 | 06:57 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,159
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The bottom third of the L CAL seniority list are made up of pilots, both off the street CAL and CAL Express pilots hired from 1989 to.... Many of those pilots were definitely working at express. I left express in 98, so I was one of them.
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