"We modify our aircraft order book"
#21
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From: A320 Cap
Best guess is an order after the first of the year of a SNB thus allowing more lift at mainline, and if I'm not mistaken allows United to increase the number of large RJ's. Further down the line wouldn't be surprised to see some combo of less 737, more Airbus's. Either new or used depending on the economy. If new at this point they would be foolish not to wait for the Max and NEO respectively in terms of fuel economy.
So yeah basically what you said
So yeah basically what you said

UAL looked at the C-Series and ended up buying the 737-700 instead knowing full well they wouldn't be able to unlock the full potential of their scope agreement. Why? Because Boeing gave them to us for so cheap we couldn't afford NOT to take them. So what's changed? I can see not wanting the CAPEX right now. But I also noticed that they are now saying that the MAX would be "bigger" so I'm guessing they will be MAX-8 or more MAX-9's. This does seem to open the door to a SNB order in order to unlock the additional RJ's. I'm guessing it's not the economics that are driving that change, but our new management adds as the economics haven't changed significantly since the recent order for the -700's.
My guess is what this means is that the transition of capacity from UAX to UAL will be greatly reduced under Kirby and Levy. More RJ jobs. Less Mainline jobs. Back to the old strategy.
#22
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From: A320 Cap
Its not a bad thing as long as they use the money to put UNITED in a better position going forward instead of the share holders that have already been taken care of to the tune of $6 billion. The hedge funds on our board were probably pushing for this.
My hope is that this opens the door to a 100 seater.......we need one we have a huge capacity gap between our large RJs and 737/319.
My hope is that this opens the door to a 100 seater.......we need one we have a huge capacity gap between our large RJs and 737/319.
#23
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From: A320 FO
The only thing I can think of is if, and as always it's a big if, they want cheap used airplanes that allow them to maximize scope is the E190.
When DAL bought the C-series they backed out of the used Air Canada 190. So there are 20 of these for cheap. Jetblue has some orders coming up they (at least when I worked there in 13) said they would like to sell the new ones or sell the old ones as they get the new ones....I believe it~25. And finally Americain said they are not keeping the 190....20 more. That's 65 used cheap airframes that gets them ~40 more e175. Plus you already have a team of contractors for maintenance (all the E175 operators) while we get our program up. Sims that can be used and probably one of them has a program that we could buy to get training up and running quickly.
Or they are going to buy a few used 737 and 320 aircraft every year to fill the need.
I don't think this is a bad idea but it was nice looking at mainline growth. Now it's back to guessing what they are planning.
When DAL bought the C-series they backed out of the used Air Canada 190. So there are 20 of these for cheap. Jetblue has some orders coming up they (at least when I worked there in 13) said they would like to sell the new ones or sell the old ones as they get the new ones....I believe it~25. And finally Americain said they are not keeping the 190....20 more. That's 65 used cheap airframes that gets them ~40 more e175. Plus you already have a team of contractors for maintenance (all the E175 operators) while we get our program up. Sims that can be used and probably one of them has a program that we could buy to get training up and running quickly.
Or they are going to buy a few used 737 and 320 aircraft every year to fill the need.
I don't think this is a bad idea but it was nice looking at mainline growth. Now it's back to guessing what they are planning.
#25
For the long term, maybe it's not a bad thing. But looking at the press releases from earlier this year, UAL ordered 40 and then another 25 700s to be delivered starting mid to late 2017 to "reduce it's 50 seat fleet of RJs by more than half by 2019". So, what are they going to do to cut the RJs now? Buy the CS100? E2? Buy more used 737s/A319s? Keep the RJs? It certainly raises questions.
As of today, 76 seat jets at UAX are capped at a max of 153 airframes and 120% of UA single isle block hours.
Last edited by awax; 11-15-2016 at 07:18 AM.
#27
Ex Pax: Saab Scandia
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Converting the 737-700 to Max 7's would represent an upgauging since I think the latest iteration of the Max 7 will actually now be a shrunk Max 8, seating about 12 extra seats compared to the 700.
But I do think that US airlines are looking at a slowdown in the travel market for at least a few months or even years as foreign visitors, both tourists and university students, digest the changes in the US political system. If the new administration imposes tariffs on China I can see part of their retaliation taking the form of a curtailment on releasing foreign exchange to support the large number of their students in US universities. I think at last count there are over 1MM foreign students at US universities of which 60% come from just 4 countries: China, India, South Korea and Saudi Arabia. If things are perceived as being less safe for a ''foreign'' looking or sounding person in the USA, I would expect a reduction in the number of the ones studying in the USA. I can see airlines wanting to be a bit cautious about growth plans.
But I do think that US airlines are looking at a slowdown in the travel market for at least a few months or even years as foreign visitors, both tourists and university students, digest the changes in the US political system. If the new administration imposes tariffs on China I can see part of their retaliation taking the form of a curtailment on releasing foreign exchange to support the large number of their students in US universities. I think at last count there are over 1MM foreign students at US universities of which 60% come from just 4 countries: China, India, South Korea and Saudi Arabia. If things are perceived as being less safe for a ''foreign'' looking or sounding person in the USA, I would expect a reduction in the number of the ones studying in the USA. I can see airlines wanting to be a bit cautious about growth plans.
Last edited by Coronado; 11-15-2016 at 08:52 AM. Reason: typos
#28
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From: B-767 FO
For the long term, maybe it's not a bad thing. But looking at the press releases from earlier this year, UAL ordered 40 and then another 25 700s to be delivered starting mid to late 2017 to "reduce it's 50 seat fleet of RJs by more than half by 2019". So, what are they going to do to cut the RJs now? Buy the CS100? E2? Buy more used 737s/A319s? Keep the RJs? It certainly raises questions.
#30
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I think this is great news. United doesn't control the economy and with so much uncertainty under trump - slowing growth to free up more money is a very wise move. I want just as much to read into all this but that's a mistake.
As for 50 seaters staying longer; I believe a lot of their retirements coincide with lease experations so I wouldn't expect to see that happen.
As for 50 seaters staying longer; I believe a lot of their retirements coincide with lease experations so I wouldn't expect to see that happen.
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