I Certainly hope you are right. Given this managements proclivities for screwing up even a sure thing, I still don't trust them. Oscar may be a nice guy, but I think the board and the "New" investors want their pound of flesh, and he is losing control.

They come up with a new fleet plan every few months. every time they do, Boeing is there saying give me more money. I'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt, but the track record demonstrates otherwise.

 

I'd prefer to phrase it "so pilots can enjoy the protections afforded by scope". Make no mistake, we paid for those protections.

 

So from a guy on the outside looking in, wanting to be at UAL, how does this bode for a 25 yr career? Are there going to be any differences here from the other legacy carriers? I feel like more dudes on the UAL thread have an optimistic approach, until recently. Would this be your first choice if you were me?

 

It all depends on the type of career you want, IMHO.

Considerations (choose your order): bases, equipment, quality of life, pay.

Each major airline is similar yet different with a varried fleet mix and strengths. For example, UA does more long haul widebody flying (4 pilots) than DAL and AA combined. For some this is a big deal while others could care less.

 

I get that the last decade and a half has seen some serious Black Swan events and that colors most everyones view, but wow, I can't believe how cynical and glass half full the whole world has become. I think the order shift is part of a larger very positive trend in improving future growth.

To whit . . . .

The above quote was taken from the other forum. There is also a slide taken from yesterday's investor conference that shows UAL talking about continuing to review the used market for further fleet enhancements.

I'll take switching orders to Airbus for 2:1 odds. Let's revisit this thread in 2 years and see how it goes.

On a slightly separate note, but still relevant . . .

Did anyone see Mr. Munoz on CNBC last night? In that interview the commentator asked about United's business plan. The plan announced at yesterday's investor conference calls for "$4.8 bil in net income enhancements by 2020". That announcement was coincident with the announcement from Warren Buffet that he invested $1.3 bil total into airlines including UAL/DAL/AA/ and SW.

I don't think you get $5 bil in earnings growth by flying more RJs or reversing growth plans.

Pollyanna? Maybe. Maybe not.

 

There's no simple answer to your question. United currently has a good pilot agreement and, for the first time since Greenwald, appears to have a CEO that want's to run an airline. Starting pay for f/o's is very good by historical standards, and upgrade times are forecast to be reasonably short (by historical standards).

That said, I would add the caveat that there are no guarantees on the future and one's career. We endured a terrible decade .. 9/11, bankruptcy (loss of pension, dramatic pay & benefit cuts, furloughs, downgrades), SARS epidemic, $175/barrel oil, Financial market meltdown, age 65, merger. The last decade was a real sh@# storm. Things seem better, for now .

Ultimately, try and work for an airline where you seem to mesh with the personality of the operation. I've always felt like United's Flight Operations policies, procedures and philosophies made sense and I've been happy here. When I was in the right seat, I was privileged to fly with some great Captains, and now I'm fortunate that, without exception, every f/o I fly with is great at the job as well.

 

You may want to remove the name from the other poster and forum...

 

Sadly I've only seen our scope get worse since we merged. Guess CAL's 50 seat max contractual language wasn't worth fighting for?

 

I'll take that bet. This cancellation spells out one thing only. Reducing Capital Expenditures and more stock buybacks. RJ's to max out at the contractual limit with a hat in hand attempt later by management to increase it.

 

If you can live in a base, very much yes. Commuting is no fun. Some people do it pretty low stress, but not many. YMMV.

This is not great news short term, but like the weather, things seem to change quickly at UA. I still think Delta, United, and Fedex are 1,2, and 2a in the good job ranking. But i am an airline pilot now and listening to me on Airlines, Investments, or Divorce tactics is a bad historical bet. Southwest wouldn't work for me, but if you live in a SW base, like multi leg days every day and like working days off to seriously enhance your income it could be right. If you love DFW or Miami, AA might be your gig even if contractually and merger wise they are a bit behind. UPS has some issues, ask a UPS pilot. But also ask them about their paycheck and you need to pay proper respect to their second year pay.

The Prime Directives stay the same:
1. Get hired somewhere first.
2. Change horses only if it enhances your QOL.
3. Avoid commuting if possible.
4. Don't buy your Captain's house with what you should save and invest.
5. Stay married to your first spouse or life partner.