FYI. DAL has been in negation for some time since the no vote. Pay rates come and pay rates go but work rules (or lack thereof) last a long time. Contracts are not just about pay rates. I wish you all the best and hope it is a TA worthy of a yes vote. If it is not, don't be afraid to say no.

 

At DAL, despite some "no" voting reps promising an immediate return to the table, it took us 5-months to reengage with management. Now, a year after rejection, we still don't have a TA.

The new Admin says we are making progress and should have a deal this summer, but then in the next breath they tell us that they've achieved no agreements on pay, work rules, scope or any of the big ticket items.

Lots of hotheads promised a quick turn, one even said we'd get a better deal in 48 hours, some "no" voting reps promised us up to 3% whenever the non contracts get a raise (that was false, we got zero). At DAL we have not seen a single nickle of negotiated improvements one year after the rejection. As a result of our "no" vote we went from the highest paid legacy to the lowest. On the bright side, we'll have 5% more profit sharing on 14% less earnings to look forward to, a handful of additional F/Os will get trips bought off for line checks. The average narrow-body captain will make about $30k less this year than he would have with the TA.

If you vote no, do it with your eyes wide open to the very real possibility that it could take several years to get another TA. Good luck to you guys.

 

Similar story at SWA. Those that say a "No" vote will be followed quickly by a TA are trying to sell their position. That being said, my armchair QB take on both DAL and SWA is that they did 100% the right thing by voting NO, regardless of how long it takes to get to a YES.

Good luck with your decision. Just weigh the pros and cons and be realistic about what a NO vote means vs taking what is on the table now.

 

Your bashing of the reps that stood for the will of the group in no way improves the concession laden POS deal you brought us. The delay was due to the recall of an inept MEC and especially a hot headed chairman who resigned in shame. His last hurrah was to sell us out on scope compliance, creating prolonged incentive for management to continue to violate.

http://www.funnyonlinepictures.com/w...2013/01/47.png

 

EXACTLY!!!



Falcon 7... You rail on profit sharing since we turned down that POS 15......but if we would have taken POS 15 our profit sharing would be way worse.....you fail to mention that...amongst other items...

 

The reps who should be recalled are the "no" voting reps like bloviating Bill Bartels, Head Butting Lewis, and Schnitzler, for their intentional lies and misrepresentations. You've proven time and time again your ignorance of what was in the TA. Tell me again where I can find the protection that keeps a DAL foreign partner from using the Delta logo and paint. You can't.

 

Delta has its own forum here, btw

 

Personally I like a little overlap here and there. Gives some perspective to those who might not scan EVERY forum.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by rail on profit sharing. PS is just one part of our contract. But your assertion that PS "would be way worse" is misleading at best.

Profit sharing % is of course just half the equation. Earnings is the other half. PS would have at worse been about 5% less, but our pay would have gone up 8% last year, 14.5% this year, 17.9% in January, 21% a year and a half from now. Over the course of a very short duration contract we would have earned significantly more which would have made the PS cut a moot point by 2018.

All in we walked away from at least $1.1B (approx $100K/pilot) on the hope that we'd get a better deal, So far, one year later, we've received zero, not even a nickle in per diem. Excuse me if I'm not jumping up and down for joy while losing money every pay check.

Enough about TA2015, my advice for the Allegiant pilots is to vote with your eyes wide open and don't rely on any follow on deal coming anytime soon if you decide to vote no. Good lucks guys.

 

Make no mistake, you are gambling with real money so it should mean something. I don't think anyone is going to be ok with EVERYTHING and that doesn't mean they are blinded by pay rates. It means they can do math. The NC has said as much and they are the ones who are in the best position to judge the room. There are gains to be had by continuing at the table but the cost is getting pretty steep. That's why this TA was signed. It comes down to what you are willing to invest for improvements, if any, that are yet to be determined. It's real life "Let's make a deal."