SladeTin

One man’s trash is another man’s treasure. Your experience at this company is totally dependent on your seniority level. I’m guessing yours is decent. Have you seen what’s happening to reserve guys these days? Yeah, that stuff NEVER happened at my previous job. Maybe your experience was different.

The reply above is spot on. This job has all the potential in the world of being the best airline gig out there. Unfortunately it will never come to pass, because of our management group that somehow thinks treating the pilots like scum of the earth is the way to success. I can’t even attempt to comprehend their thought process with this. At this point I’m done even trying to though. It’s just the way it will always be at Allegiant.

Margaritaville

More like USAir 1988-2004.

Another management troll? If only you guys spent as much time running this "airline" (travel company), as you spend trolling this site and lowering expectations.

Systemic contract violations. Abuse of fly now, grieve later. Openly violating every section of the CBA and laughing in our faces about it. Suing arbitrators who rule against them. 1000s of grievances filed, scores awaiting arbitration. They are tying to run the union out of money.

Laying off 20% of our pilots (40% of FOs), creating a massive understaffing situation. Furloughees being used as a political football by the company. Requiring the remaining pilots to work 90+ hour lines. Widespread junior manning in a traditionally slow flying month.

Creating a new term they call "vacancy reductions" that's unheard of in the industry. Using this new term instead of the traditional "displacement" to realign the bases. Those whose "vacancy is reduced" will get bumped out of their domicile, and will not get bump/flush displacement rights to displace to a base they want. Instead, they will be forced to bid vacancies that the company stipulates. This will cause seniority inversions across the system. Senior people will get bumped out of southern bases where they live, and forced to commute to places like Des Moines, Grand Rapids, Allentown, Indianapolis, or Pittsburgh in January. Worse, they announced this with a disclaimer that if the union starts playing ball with them in the next 10 days, all of this horror may go away.

Abuse of reserves:
4 hour "limo" (2003 Saturn) rides to remote bases at 50% deadhead pay.
Taking away "golden days" (immovable per the CBA), and assigning trips or even reserve shifts. Chief pilots agree it's wrong but have no power to stop it.
Reserves being given rental cars and told to drive 4 hours then fly an 8 hour trip. Threat of "no show" if they refuse.
Calling reserves at 3AM when shift starts, to notify of an 11AM show "because they can".
Calling reserves late into a shift to "release" them, attempting to trap them into a "no contact", because they can.

All of this because the union refuses to give them contract concessions. The company's last proposal, which the union rightfully shot down, was a 60% pay cut for the bottom 275 pilots, which would have put them on a B Scale. They would have been making close to minimum wage on 1st year pay. Other proposals have included the ability to place pilots on reduced or even zero hour lines, irrespective of seniority. It's worth noting that the company has steadily increased their cash position throughout the pandemic, while reducing their daily cash burn. They keep bragging to their investors what great shape the company is in, and even talk about all the opportunities the pandemic is creating. The executive in charge of the mothballed resort project got $15 million dollars in total compensation. We are currently the lowest paid airbus pilots in the USA.

So yeah, this company has rewritten the book on union busting. The work environment here makes the bottom feeder regionals look good. This is the worst it's been since 2014. When times are good and things are growing this place is fine to work at, but as soon as they get bad, management turns on the employees. It comes all the way down from the top. It's a totally toxic management culture. They truly hate us. This has been a huge wake up call for all the pilots hired post contract, who thought everything was great here. Unfortunately, this is the real Allegiant Air.

I hope those in the future think twice before coming to work here, when they look back at this time capsule. Browse the posts from 2014-2015 as well. This is this company's true culture. Consider yourself warned. Sleeping in your own bed every night is useless when they ship you all over the country on reserve or bump/TDY you out of your home base for months on end.

BobbyLeeSwagger

Wow, that is truly mind blowing.

GoFaster

This is disheartening. Allegiant has been at the top of my list for a while. I had some concerns - what happens if your base closes, etc. but overall it seems like a really great fit for somebody who values family time and being at home every night.

JustWatching

To be fair, what's happening to our reserves is not unexpected because we did it to ourselves. You know what I'm referring to.

CAirBear

Everything written these last 2 pages is 1000% correct. It is refreshing to see some people are waking up.

Back in 2016 I spent 2.5 years there before leaving for a competing Airbus ULCC. The grass isn’t just greener, it looks like Augusta National.

Simply put, people don’t know what they don’t know. All of the lifers that can’t/won’t leave just assume getting treated like trash is simply par for the course at NK, F9, B6 and every legacy out there. It’s incredibly sad.

I am now treated with the respect and professionalism that we all deserve. It isn’t lip service. It’s real and I (even before the pandemic) did not renew my AirlineApps this last year.

I flew with some really nice folks, like most airlines, and I did enjoy most CAs. I remember when I told them I was leaving.

You could hear it in their voices that, some, wanted to leave too, but they were golden handcuffed to the place. I get it. Your there 10+ years and top of the scale so you think/can’t move on. It sucks.

I was in a class of 10. There are 4 left from my class. Only 1 of them, my old sim partner, fits the mold and lives in base, kids and is older etc. I suspect even he would be leaving if he were able to. The other 3? No idea.

I’m still friends with them all and I hear the constant and pathetic BS that has (and will continue to) happen. It’s just incredible anyone deals with that. If your justification of being treated like absolute trash is “but I’m home every night” you have to take a step back and really think about this. Do you value yourself and demand respect? If so, why are you putting your self worth on the back burner because your home?

I commuted (willingly and didn’t complain about it) while at Allegiant. It wasn’t that big of a deal for me. I like where I live, have and always will commute. I had my own room/apartment in base and another car.

My hometown was announced as a base 6 months after leaving. I knew that within 1-2 years of leaving it would most likely become a base. It’s a great market for Allegiant and had been rumored for a long time. When I heard the news, I simply laughed and went about my day. Not a single ounce of regret whatsoever.

I can honestly say, even with doing overnight trips now, that I would still be “home” more where I work now than if I were based at home with Allegiant. I’ll explain.

The way the schedules work (and granted maybe it is more tolerable in smaller bases) you will either do a west coast or FL out and back. The junior guys, will do long duty and oftentimes unproductive block 4 leg days. You may only get 1-3 out and backs a month.

Essentially the long out and backs go senior and middle of the pack/junior guys will have 10-12 hour duty days and maybe only block 4-5 hours for the day.

They are long days and when you “get home” you aren’t really home. You aren’t kicking it with the boys, or have seen your family/kids all day. Your tired. If your unlucky (Which is def likely) you’ll be doing the exact same day 11 hours later and having to go to bed.

With my seniority I would probably be getting 12-14 days off a month and doing long unproductive days. Because even if I were the only FO that wanted this base, it would go unfilled and every month VBD guys, all senior to me, would be bidding in and getting the good trips.

My schedule would not be 4-ON 3-OFF (industry standard). Every single month I would never know WTF this CBI trash was going to decide for me. Allegiant doesn’t use legitimate bidding software (despite the contract saying it was to be mandated 3 years ago). They use some in house excel spreadsheet.

Like clockwork at least 2-3 days a month I would be denied a day off because “High Demand Everyone Must Work” today. Then when Open Time comes out, you’ll soon realize that was a lie and you could have been awarded it off.

So some months, due to complete luck, I may get a great schedule that accommodates all of my friends/family needs and is perfect. Then, with the same seniority, the next month it is complete trash and now you need to call in sick, or do a slew of BS to get the days off you need. There is ZERO Rhyme or Reason for this.

Also junior folks are routinely “Involuntary TDY” out of their base 3-5 months a year (base specific - not all). So you come here, you move to PGD, and all is well. Now 3 or more months a year your sent to MYR or some other outstation base against your will, trying to get back home with 2 days off a week. Great times.

My current shop - It’s a joke how effortless it is to do whatever it is I need to do with my schedule. Even when I was the most junior line holder, It took no effort to adjust my schedule as needed to accommodate for family/friends events.

I routinely average 16-17 off a month and there is a good bit of difference between my Block vs Credit. Fly 60 credit 90 kinda thing. That happens routinely.

That is another issue with day trips. You want to credit 95 hours? Get ready to fly ALL of that. Outside of picking up up a Reserve Period (and not getting called) soft time doesn’t really exist at Allegiant.

Don’t even get me started on the grievances and the arbitrations Management continues in violate. I mean I have no words, how a pilot group doesn’t have immediate strike recourse when the company was told, by a judge, that you can’t do this anymore and yet the company continues to do it. Absolutely no words. This such a broken F’d up world and system. My god.

G4 will never be a place I can, with good faith, ever recommend to anyone. Why MG continues to trash his most important work group, is incredible. He isn’t smart.

If you think he is, because he’s made money, I don’t know what to tell you. Allegiant would be poised for even far greater earnings with some respect and humility shown.

My current shop - our management team worked - hand in hand - with our MEC and mitigated 600 furloughs. It was done with respect and cooperation that will absolutely never be seen at Allegiant.

At the end of the day, I value myself enough that I don’t tolerate Disrespect and I will not work for those that don’t value or treat me with respect. It’s that simple. I don’t change my values because “I’m home every night”.

To each their own, but anyone coming here needs to seriously reconsider. Anyone with questions feel free to PM.

G4er

[QUOTE=CAirBear;3150279]Everything written these last 2 pages is 1000% correct. It is refreshing to see some people are waking up.

Back in 2016 I spent 2.5 years there before leaving for a competing Airbus ULCC. The grass isn’t just greener, it looks like Augusta National.

Simply put, people don’t know what they don’t know. All of the lifers that can’t/won’t leave just assume getting treated like trash is simply par for the course at NK, F9, B6 and every legacy out there. It’s incredibly sad.

I am now treated with the respect and professionalism that we all deserve. It isn’t lip service. It’s real and I (even before the pandemic) did not renew my AirlineApps this last year.

I flew with some really nice folks, like most airlines, and I did enjoy most CAs. I remember when I told them I was leaving.

You could hear it in their voices that, some, wanted to leave too, but they were golden handcuffed to the place. I get it. Your there 10+ years and top of the scale so you think/can’t move on. It sucks.

I was in a class of 10. There are 4 left from my class. Only 1 of them, my old sim partner, fits the mold and lives in base, kids and is older etc. I suspect even he would be leaving if he were able to. The other 3? No idea.

I’m still friends with them all and I hear the constant and pathetic BS that has (and will continue to) happen. It’s just incredible anyone deals with that. If your justification of being treated like absolute trash is “but I’m home every night” you have to take a step back and really think about this. Do you value yourself and demand respect? If so, why are you putting your self worth on the back burner because your home?

I commuted (willingly and didn’t complain about it) while at Allegiant. It wasn’t that big of a deal for me. I like where I live, have and always will commute. I had my own room/apartment in base and another car.

My hometown was announced as a base 6 months after leaving. I knew that within 1-2 years of leaving it would most likely become a base. It’s a great market for Allegiant and had been rumored for a long time. When I heard the news, I simply laughed and went about my day. Not a single ounce of regret whatsoever.

I can honestly say, even with doing overnight trips now, that I would still be “home” more where I work now than if I were based at home with Allegiant. I’ll explain.

The way the schedules work (and granted maybe it is more tolerable in smaller bases) you will either do a west coast or FL out and back. The junior guys, will do long duty and oftentimes unproductive block 4 leg days. You may only get 1-3 out and backs a month.

Essentially the long out and backs go senior and middle of the pack/junior guys will have 10-12 hour duty days and maybe only block 4-5 hours for the day.

They are long days and when you “get home” you aren’t really home. You aren’t kicking it with the boys, or have seen your family/kids all day. Your tired. If your unlucky (Which is def likely) you’ll be doing the exact same day 11 hours later and having to go to bed

At the end of the day, I value myself enough that I don’t tolerate Disrespect and I will not work for those that don’t value or treat me with respect. It’s that simple. I don’t change my values because “I’m home every night”.


Family first, then work is the reason I stay. I value the respect of my family. Good for you that you are in lush green pastures. I wouldn’t give up being home with my family every night for any airline. I like your condescending tone, “my feelings are so important that I would take that over spending more time with my family” Implying my values are messed up. If I traded my schedule for yours my wife would never respect me again. That’s what I love about her, she gets it.

SloNLow

A lot of whining going on. I get it. Some pilots aren’t cut out for this job. Good grief, we fly a few legs per day...usually two. I actually enjoy my job at Allegiant and choose G4 over the Legacies, as do others. Hoping for a speedy return for our furloughed pilots.

Margaritaville

Most of the people who feel this way are senior in base and seat, therefore it doesn't affect them, so they don't care. "I'm in! Quick, pull up the ladder"!

There's a lot that needs to be improved in this place, and just because it hasn't hit you yet, doesn't mean it won't. I guarantee, when it does, the two or you will be whining the loudest on the union's ***** page.

Margaritaville

Thanks for the summary.

How about telling us what the schedules are like at Spirit? Hotel quality? Long overnights or SWA style with 5 legs and then 12 hours at the Holiday Inn Express? Productive trips? Contract compliance? Lots of red eyes like Frontier? Good maintenance? Are the passengers really as bad as the media portrays? Management/union relationship?

You guys going to be hiring next year?