PRS Guitars

There was an APA email regarding occupational dates. I might be misinterpreting it, but it looks like they are using that in the future for seniority (as AA always has) rather than DOH. Why does the union want to use this date? It hurts pilots financially for their first 12 years by delaying yearly pay scale raises. This in turn reduces the dues that the APA collects. I just don't see the benefit. It has zero effect on senior pilots, so I can't figure this out.

The whole concept seems to contradict the APA's hardline stance on seniority. On day one of class you bid assignments based on age seniority, then that earned seniority (based on age) could be stripped away depending on your class completion date.

They might even retroactively assign Occ dates to constructive notice hire pilots from the LUS side. I certainly hope they don't start using that date for our future pay raises retroactively.

DCA A321 FO

Because APA is in bed with the company, gets clearer and clearer everyday.

PRS Guitars

That's the thing though, I don't think upper management even knows about this or gives a $hit. This is well below DP's level.

eaglefly

In this situation, I think they are just complying with the CBA (JCBA) which still embraces the concept of occupational seniority and attempting to adjust newer pilots to cohesive order. I suppose we could seek to change that, but Doug will expect a concession to agree to that.

Just my opinion off the cuff with no research.

Hercnhawk

I think the company is pushing for the AA style occ date to save on 2 months worth of LOS wage increases. They are STILL negotiating what to do with those of us that were hired between Dec 13 and Nov 15. If it wasn't for the $ I would think the company would have rolled over long ago and went with DOH.

jcountry

The part I don't understand is how and why the union appears to want to make this retroactive.

I don't understand that at all. From that email, it looks like they want the JCBA to retroactively apply to all those people who were hired before it was signed.

Jetwash

The problem lies in that a guy like me who was hired into a split class of LAA and LUS pilots post Dec13 will have seniority differences due to the two different dates.

They have to sync that up but as with any kind of "synergy" someone will get screwed. Sounds like most likely the guys senior to me in my LUS class, since they bid training the farthest out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cheddar

This subject came up in an APA Hotline last year, and I got to talk to one of my base reps F2F about it. From the "interviews and class dates" thread:

When telling my LAA rep my concerns, his exact words were: "what do you care, you're going to have a great career anyway." Now, to be honest, I actually like him, although this pi$$d me off. This has received some pushback from LAA new hires, as we are no longer probies and are sending in soundoffs. I have a good friend who is close to someone on the NC, and was told flat out "the company doesn't want to backdate the OCC date for LAA new hires as it would cost them 'too much.' They are 'working' on a solution, not only to the mixed classes, but also all preceding classes as LUS started on Mondays and LAA started on Tuesdays. My guess, from my veeeerrrry limited third person knowledge is a 2.5:1 or 2:1 LAA:LUS ratio for seniority, based loosely on the overall ratio of LAA:LUS hires during that time period. I have NOT seen that proposal anywhere in anything official though, so - grain of salt. Would I like straight DOH for all new hires after the DEC 13 merger announcement - yes. It's not the DOH v. OCC date that's a concern (yes the two months of pay inequality for 12 years blows), its that the APA and Company had plenty of time to figure this out, and punted. Merging this after the fact is gonna be a cluster. Regardless, like Jetwash said, "someone's gonna get screwed."

full of luv

Wow, sometimes when I read the AA threads, it's like AA mgmt just invents ways to divide or keep the pilots divided as a group and at odds within themselves.

PRS Guitars

[QUOTE=Cheddar;2026310My guess, from my veeeerrrry limited third person knowledge is a 2.5:1 or 2:1 LAA:LUS ratio for seniority, based loosely on the overall ratio of LAA:LUS hires during that time period. I have NOT seen that proposal anywhere in anything official though, so - grain of salt.[/QUOTE]

***!? I hope you're wrong, that would then skew the process big time towards LAA side. The idea is to get an apples to Apple slotting (talking constructive notice guys here) not somehow get the LAA side a better position. Just using straight DOH (instead of occ) for constructive notice hires, solves the problem and is what the three parties agreed to.

You're union rep story confirms what I've always thought though, which is the union doesn't give a $hit about junior guys. They can GFT's...