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Originally Posted by nitefr8dog
(Post 2519558)
Wow...you really have no idea how this works. K4 can still do the same flying ..just not let the company do it on the cheap. Airline a crew into position and go to crew rest. Management has been serving you the kool-aid...you don't have to drink it. When we fly these trips that are "necessary for our operation " we have a max 16 hrs and another crew picks it up from there. How hard is that to understand? Almost every ACMI carrier has had to compete from the bottom because K4, ATI, Southern had pilots willing to work with horible pay and work rules. Why would not have taken thos opportunity to change that?....weak!
K4 max duty day is 17 that compares to your 16 and you are constantly up our shorts over an hour? we have a good contract that allows for a nice lifestyle and BTW QOL here is just fine its so busy here you can basically write your own paycheck new hires cant help making more than 100k 1st year some much more I have really had it with atlas guys tearing us down tell you what - go negotiate your own contract and leave us out of it |
Originally Posted by Jason605
(Post 2519567)
The take away from this post is we have to have a garbage duty day to be competitive. You people still just don't get what a Union is and what it's responsible for. It's the managements duty to compete, not yours.
This mentality is just mind blowing. do you consider 14 hrs a garbage duty day? |
At Kalitta we went from a 30 hour max duty day for a double crew to a 24 hour max duty day for a double crew after the arbitration. I'm curious as to how long you guys whining about that think we should have held out for fewer hours? Another month? 6 months? A year? After six years of negotiations we took a significant gain in the area of duty times and a large gain in pay rates and quality of life issues. Also, many areas of our contract were negotiated in the years when the industry was not as robust as it is now. Things that were TA'd in 2013 or 2014 don't look particularly impressive right now but were not bad in the era they were agreed to. That is why there is pattern bargaining. We raise the bar in one or two areas and the next group does the same. By the time it gets back around to us again the floor will hopefully have been raised considerably.
I look forward to building on the contracts that Atlas, ABX or others sign before we begin section 6 talks in a few years. Instead of crying over spilt milk, perhaps it is you who should worry about not letting the rest of us down. It is easy to talk big when you have not signed a new contract. The proof will be in the document YOU eventually agree to. |
Originally Posted by sky jet
(Post 2519593)
At Kalitta we went from a 30 hour max duty day for a double crew to a 24 hour max duty day for a double crew after the arbitration. I'm curious as to how long you guys whining about that think we should have held out for fewer hours? Another month? 6 months? A year? After six years of negotiations we took a significant gain in the area of duty times and a large gain in pay rates and quality of life issues. Also, many areas of our contract were negotiated in the years when the industry was not as robust as it is now. Things that were TA'd in 2013 or 2014 don't look particularly impressive right now but were not bad in the era they were agreed to. That is why there is pattern bargaining. We raise the bar in one or two areas and the next group does the same. By the time it gets back around to us again the floor will hopefully have been raised considerably.
I look forward to building on the contracts that Atlas, ABX or others sign before we begin section 6 talks in a few years. Instead of crying over spilt milk, perhaps it is you who should worry about not letting the rest of us down. It is easy to talk big when you have not signed a new contract. The proof will be in the document YOU eventually agree to. |
Originally Posted by Lockheed
(Post 2519582)
Jason
do you consider 14 hrs a garbage duty day? |
Originally Posted by nitefr8dog
(Post 2519558)
Wow...you really have no idea how this works. K4 can still do the same flying ..just not let the company do it on the cheap. Airline a crew into position and go to crew rest. Management has been serving you the kool-aid...you don't have to drink it. When we fly these trips that are "necessary for our operation " we have a max 16 hrs and another crew picks it up from there. How hard is that to understand? Almost every ACMI carrier has had to compete from the bottom because K4, ATI, Southern had pilots willing to work with horible pay and work rules. Why would not have taken thos opportunity to change that?....weak!
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Originally Posted by Globemaster2827
(Post 2519565)
Do you really think that any of these companies would open Retirement early? All of us should be subtracting about 12-15% from our rates, because if you're not investing that you will be eating dog food in retirement. I don't understand why none of us are willing to fight over that....
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Originally Posted by Jason605
(Post 2519599)
I considered any rule that allowed the crew to sleep in an airplane for 24 hours garbage, yes. And I think Atlas is just as nuts for having similar rules. Hence why I'm sticking it out at ABX instead of following up on your offer.
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Originally Posted by maxjet
(Post 2519601)
Hey dumbut. With this post you have informed all of us at K4 that you know nothing of which you talk of. Position a crew into position? Oh yea, please sign me up for a overnight in the “air conditioned” tent in Baghram. Oh wait! Flight is delayed, now cancelled. Oh, now ride back out on Iraqi Air. You are a moron. You rant about quality of life, yet you want us to have to stay in one of Trumps —-hole countries?
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Originally Posted by Jason605
(Post 2519599)
I considered any rule that allowed the crew to sleep in an airplane for 24 hours garbage, yes. And I think Atlas is just as nuts for having similar rules. Hence why I'm sticking it out at ABX instead of following up on your offer.
it can not be said enough that ABEX leaders gave us support at 1224 exco when we needed it and they were the only ones UPS pilots sleep on their 747's Atlas pilots sleep on their 747's and we at k4 do to - its nice to take a 2hr break on a 7hr flt but how about people comment with actual knowledge these are K4 max Scheduled duty days 14 hrs - 2 pilot crew 17 hrs - 3 pilot crew 24 hrs - 4 pilot crew rarely and I do mean RARELY does a Double crew have a duty day in excess of 18 hrs - the reason they use 2x crew is because the flt time is more than 12hrs We at K4 LIKE those trips - we like them a lot - they make us lots of money If pilots at other airlines want something different that is up to them - not me |
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