flyfranz

I got my first choice this month of flying lines. However, I was taken off due to training and my entire line was changed. Now instead of having no overnights in cvg, I have 4 nights in a hotel at my own cost. I bid lines with minimum layovers in cvg for a reason. To save money on hotels.
If you’re considering coming here, you should figure on added hotel costs.

JonnyKnoxville

If I were to go over to the other website and start posting about how all future 767 deliveries are going to be stopped at ATSG and replaced with SR-71s and Cessna Caravans, that is not me disagreeing with the party line (whatever the party line is anyway), it would be me talking about something I have no clue about and I would just be flat out wrong.

Look man, with all due respect, you have certain preconceived notions about the Atlas and ABX pilot group that you share with us from time to time and they are flat out wrong. Your perception is off. I am not sure where your anger, mistrust, frustration, or whatever it is comes from, but you are spreading misinformation and it makes you look bad. That is not some kind of party line, it is my opinion that I share with you and if I am sharing it, you can bet others are thinking it. Your views on this topic are no different than me talking on the other site about the ATI Sr-71s coming that I saw being converted to freighters in Pinal Airpark last week.

zerozero

I'd like to drill down on these two points.

First, the safety issue is a valid and real concern. The problem is, due to the ongoing investigation there are very few usable FACTS. Everyone outside of the investigation has opinions and hunches, but you cannot leverage opinions and hunches into immediate fixes or stand downs. Thus, it will be business as usual until the official report is completed (notwithstanding the increasing reports of failures coming from the Training Dept).

Secondly, "more of what we're looking for" is exactly what we're getting! We are challenging the company head on with respect to their stubborn insistence that we either amalgamate or we'll sue you to amalgamate.

The company continues to tell investors "this is a process". No, this is shuck and jive they SELL to the investors.

This pilot group has rights under the RLA to bargain fairly, but has been scammed out of those rights from the very day the holding company was established.

They only way to get "more of what we're looking for" is to directly challenge the amalgamation in the courts so it doesn't happen again.

That indeed is a "process". This is fighting fire with fire. So you may laugh at the message on a mobile billboard, but that's just for the media photo ops and soundbites on stations like, you know, CNBC, Business Insider, The Washington Post, ALL the SEA media stations...

Unfortunately for the pilots, customers and investors, the real fight will be in the courtroom.

wjcandee

See, I think you're missing an opportunity. AMC most certainly can investigate anything it wants at any time, as can Congress. AMC/Congress doesn't need a final NTSB report before it can investigate hiring standards, training standards, and operational errors. The investigation, and what it is finding, is often enough to propel management into a "we're fixing it" mode.

dc10pilot

[QUOTE=wjcandee;2822429]See, I think you're missing an opportunity. AMC most certainly can investigate anything it wants at any time, as can Congress. AMC/Congress doesn't need a final NTSB report before it can investigate hiring standards, training standards, and operational errors. The investigation, and what it is finding, is often enough to propel management into a "we're fixing it" mode.[/QUOT

This is a ABX interview thread not one of the many Atlas threads
stick to the topic -- as usual it has turned into a Atlas one

zerozero

This is in fact an ABX thread. So we should move our concerns to another one.

But just one thing, do you realize that Atlas trains the 89th crews to fly Air Force One? The military is probably closer to the training dept than you realize.

wjcandee

I think this discussion has run its course anyway.

FWIW, I did know that -- or at least I knew that they did so at one time -- but, you're right, I wasn't thinking of that point as we discussed this. It's potentially yet another angle for you guys. Atlas does the Doomsday Plane crew training as well.

And just to close the loop on the "litigation" discussion here, and end my participation in all of this, my own feeling is that Gleason makes a very fine presentation in court, in general and in the current litigation. He has precisely the right demeanor for an appearance before the Second Circuit. The O'Melveny guy comes off as a bit agitated and sweaty. A lot of Big Firm guys don't get a lot of stand-up appellate time, so that's not that unusual. I don't think that Gleason got his butt handed to him in oral argument, as some have suggested, and I think you can only handicap a result about half the time from the questions asked, but looking at it as objectively as possible, the creative arguments he raised probably have a low probability of success and the Court did zero in on some of the key questions. This is only Step 1 of many anyway, deciding whether the question of whether the contracts govern the issue of merging lists under these circumstances goes to arbitration. Which is why, absent a negotiated overall solution, this is going to be interminable for you guys.

point432

After a year, the answer would still be NO!

HR is still getting guys and lying right to their faces. The company wont even accept the economics of ABX being cheaper than ATI, but the they’re so hard on for ATI. People! Why do you keep showing up?! Are they telling guys a contract is “right around the corner?” Or “so many news planes that are going to be on property in only a few months.” They’re lies people!!!

Do they need to phone a friend? Or do they not know how to use a computer?

Yes, people are still wanting to wait it out on either side of the list. (No one is calling and chasing lateral moves just get annoying) This could be the biggest waste of your life...all for a 76 type and to fly 200 hrs a year.

The company wants to make this place worse than everywhere else. They want to cut vacation, cut all soft pay, forced overtime with zero reward...all while continuing to put you in a middle seat next to the crapper. You will need a crashpad, don’t forget. Living at the DHL hub...its just sad sometimes. JRM is only 130-150% above straight pay btw. And man do guys love doing overtime for straight pay. Love it!!! They gobble it up. The pay here is so low that a number of new hires probably have to.

ABX is not the best kept secret in aviation, its a never ending nightmare of disappointment. Motorclutch is retired, but i’m sure he’d still take your calls.

You want ABX news...No new news. The company refuses to negotiate or consider any real solutions to problems. Can’t believe people hired these guys to just warm a seat in an office and use the word “No.”


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Guinnesslovr

ATI is hiring. Both under the ATSG umbrella, but completely different companies.

point432

Yeah go there. Rumor over here is, ATI is getting all the DHL and AZ tails starting soon from Atlas. That should make it less than a 6 month upgrade.