GrummanCT

I'm curious what you are giving up nosidnostar? How long do you have in corporate aviation and your current job? Is it possible to make it to retirement with your current position? How many years would you have at the airlines if age 65 remains? Total remuneration package you currently have and what type you currently fly?

How long do you estimate it will take you at the airlines to have a comparable QOL (assuming you have a decent one now?)? What is your projected earning potential for the remainder of your career if you make it to your preferred airline, versus you finishing your career part 91 at your preferred department?

I'm not trying to bait you at all, i'm actually really curious. For some reason I feel like you may have said you have 15-20 years in Part 91 aviation? Maybe more? If you are comfortable sharing, I genuinely want to know what draws the line and makes someone who has presumably spent at least half his career in corporate aviation go to the airlines. Total remuneration, schedule, qol, stability in current position etc. Really hope you will share. Thanks!

RI830

As a certain "guy" told me once.....you're doing Fabulous!
Pronounced....Fab-u-Lie!

7Xdriver

No, yer still an *ss....

Airhoss

Airhoos,

No that's straight salary. The few guys who are playing the scam a premium trip, stay out on the road, never go home game would be pulling down nearly 500K if you looked at their total package. But lets keep in mind that there aren't many guys who can or want to pull it off and if you were hired today you won't be pulling max left seat premium trip pay for a VERY VERY long time. It's kind of one of those I heard about a guy who made Blah blah last month but I don't personally know anybody who has done it. Though it is real and it does exist it's a tiny little fraction of people who are willing or able to pull it off.

The APC site is WRONG the most JR LCAL cap is a 2003or 2004 hire. the most JR LUAL hire is in the 1995 or 96ish range. I can hold 737 captain everywhere on paper I can hold 756 Cap in a couple of places on paper. The problem is the vacancy bids have been going WAY senior to me for those seats. Just because you can hold it on paper doesn't mean you can get it on a bid.

Re-upgrade that is. This merger cost me the left seat and the ISL placed me into an unfortunate category. I am kind of in no mans land as far as seniority goes at the moment. Which is why I mentioned that you can't say with certainty that (x) pilot will be able to hold (y) seat and fleet with (Z) amount of years on the property. An LCAL guy who was hired the exact same year and day I was is about 2000 to 3000 numbers senior to me at the moment. It's the airlines bro, stuff happens...

3 from the bottom on the 757 in Den. So yeah I am STUCK on reserve for now unless I want to move or commute. I could bid down to the 737 as an F/O and hold a line but I won't do it given my current circumstances.

I enjoyed my corporate job but I wouldn't leave here to go back to it.

It really depends on the month some months I fly a max hours max days which equates to 13 days off a month with 85 to 89 hours flown. Some months I hardly fly at all.

Long call between 10 and 13 hours notice to show time or short call 2.5 hours to show time or field standby, sitting at the airport waiting for the phone to ring. So the month of reserve is a mixture of those three I generally get one or two short calls a week.

That really depends on what they want out of life. There are some spectacular corporate jobs out there if you can find one. At least with the airlines you pretty much know what you're getting when you sign up. So my advice is to plan for an airline career and if you happen to stumble into a star studded cream puff of a corporate job don't be shy to snag it. I feel that I have much more flexibility in my life as an airline pilot even on reserve than I ever did as a corporate guy. Your mileage may vary. And lets keep in mind that I've had ONE corporate job with one company. So my experience pool is limited in that regard.

I can't do that. It's a personal choice, you have to weigh all the options and make your own decision. I know guys who've left here to go to a corporate job and love it. I know those who regret that decision too. Same same from the other side.

No worries I am on short call from 1200 to 0200 today. So being on house arrest affords me time to answer lots of questions on the net.

If you interview at an airline the way you come across on APC I wouldn't bother leaving my day job if I were you..
^
And I'm okay with that, you stay golden pony boy!

NoSidNoStar

Airhoss, thank you for your time
7xdriver, good one, I will get you back one day

Grum, you are the guy that was bragging would get another pilot fired for enforcing his contract. You are what is wrong with corporate jobs.
You don't get answers or smiles.
I do intended to be harsh and antagonistic with you.
Sorry to everybody else, but this kid tickles me the wrong way.

Std Deviation

Corporate jobs vary. I spent 6 plus years at FlightSafety and got to know a lot of departments so I heard the good, bad, and ugly. I also know of two Fortune 50 departments that recently hired pilots fresh out of college with minimum flight experience. An instant six figure payoff for a 20 something in lieu of slogging it out at the regionals for 26K a year and a commute.

GrummanCT

Didn't expect an answer, but I get the picture.

You won't, but you should go back and re-read our discussion. When you do, give me a direct quote where I say that I will fire a pilot for enforcing his/her contract. You're not going to find that, because it was never said. You have become drunk over words you have made up.

What I did say, and I will say it again because I stand by my words is…"I guess what i'm trying to get across is that when your in a small flight department, you don't have the same protections as being 1 of 2,746 other pilots. It's nice to have this stuff in writing for when you really need it, but if your turning trips down on principal when you are 1 of 2, you are likely going to find yourself looking for a new job, and rightfully so IMO."

Eff me for not having to live by my cell phone, or having 4 or 8 hour notice though. To have a boss that recognizes that the people that fly his airplanes are human and have families and their own personal life too. So 24 hour notice is offered, during a period in which the employee IS AVAILABLE to fly I might add, to allow that pilot to make scheduled doctors appointments, take care of their children, meet with realtors, go out of town, etc…

But according to you I should tell my boss, "Don't. You. Dare call me with less then 24 hours notice. I don't care that I am 1 of 2 and available to fly right now. (available as in non hard day off). You should have hired 10 other pilots, thats not my problem. How dare you even consider calling me. You wait for me!!!

If you have one of those jobs great, but I think you are out of touch with the reality of corporate aviation supporting a small business in a 2 man flight department if you think that is the norm. 3% of business aviation is power house fortune 500 companies…The rest is a mix including a lot of small companies that can't afford to hire a third or fourth full time pilot. You'll say that person/company shouldn't own a jet, blah blah blah, but whatever.

Your attitude isn't just counterproductive, it's jealous and self entitled. The way you come across on here, I really can't see you keeping long term employment at any flight department. You bragged over sitting in your car in the parking lot, purposely making your company wait, because your not going to show up 1 second before your contract says you have to. You will take each and every time, the most expensive hotels on the road because if it's good enough for your boss, it's good enough for you. (Your words) Really? Who are you? I'm sorry, but that mindset and attitude just isn't what is found in most flight departments. I'd like to hear from others…7x, airhoss. Would this attitude last in your department?

But thanks for raising the bar nosid. Enjoy those "mini vacations" you keep bringing up, sounds awesome! And Merry Christmas,
i'm sure the JW Cayman's is super awesome that time of year!

wrxpilot

That's gotta be nice having Dad or whoever as the CP for those guys. But if I was a line pilot in that department, I wouldn't be very happy about it. Babysitting some newbie on large equipment doing international trips? Yeah, sounds like a great idea.

RI830

Our department takes pride in saving money where we can and for the right reasons. The biggest things are fuel burns, hangar fees (always negotiable) and other misc expenses. We uses Marriott exclusively and stay mostly Renaissance and full service Marriott. But do stay in the Courtyard and other brand when needed. But also with that said, we aren't sacrificing quality either, we won't stay in the no tell motel. Some of the newly renovated Courtyards are better than full service Marriotts.

I would feel awkward if I stayed where the boss stays. My personality just doesn't fit that type of place.

Dinners are always eat and drink what you want. We also respect that we are eating on someone else's dime.
I eat and live much better on the road than at home. As I do at home, I do on the road and try to save money where I can.

We just finished a 3 weeker in Europe back in June. A few weeks ago the company accountant accused us of eating donuts and airplane stock. She said our total cost was amazingly low. We ate and drank like animals and stayed in very nice hotels!
A little leg work on cost savings and tricks gets you a long way in quality and cost savings.

GrummanCT

100% agree. We are the lucky ones to have these "perks", and I'm hesitant to say perks when in my opinion they should be standard for all professional flight crews in business aviation. It's pretty sad that there are business pilots never getting better then the la Quinta Inn, having restricted by on rental cars, and a fixed/limited meal allowance or worse yet, per diem that works out to about$50 bucks a day. A lot of these cases are due to cheap owners and penny pinching departments, but you can't ignore the fact that those who have taken advantage for years by staying at JW's/Ritz when full service Marriott's are next door for $500 less a night, and uncontrolled food spending well beyond what you would do on your own dime have absolutely contributed to these loss of "perks" by many in our profession.

And I don't think nosid stays at the same hotels as the jet owner. Even he knows that is against best practices...it's just the attitude of, if it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. If your boss is cool with that, great, but it's not the norm, and I don't think most flight departments would find that attitude as being in touch with reality.