JungleBus

Interesting, thanks for the history refresher.

crewdawg

True, but for a little balance let's look at UAL, which are being paid $352/hr. Also, the vast majority of our 330 pilots are being paid the 333-200/300 rate of $334/hr.

sailingfun

True for now, in 4 years there will be more 900’s.

crewdawg

Agreed, but a few points on that. Even after we take delivery of our current order of 900s, they will still make up less than half of the 330 fleet. I'm not fully aware of how the deployment of the 900 will go, but for now, I don't expect to ever see it unless I somehow get a SEA trip. Finally, EVERY UAL pilot who flies a 787 trip will get paid the top rate, no 787-8 pay or 787-9 pay...just the top rate. A top rate that is $13/hr more than our 339 guys, but $18/hr more than a vast majority of our 330 pilots. We're moving close to the same amount of people (in some cases more) to mostly the same destinations, it makes no sense to be paid differently.

Baradium

I've flown with multiple 737As who hate the 737 and love the Airbus but are on the 737 because it pays a bit more. I think you'd be surprised how often that happens on the narrowbody airframes.

With the same pay those pilots would probably accept a little worse schedule on the airbus because they like it, but those who didn't care about which airframe would likely chase the better schedule. You'd have less opportunity to pick an airframe simply for QOL as it averaged out.

CGfalconHerc

Well said! Even with WB/NB banding..there would be very little movement once a pilot became senior in either band. The supposition that banding would reduce training events is an exact result of stagnation in senior categories. With multiple pay rates, theres more choice for those willing to sacrifice pay rates for QOL, airframe preference, commuting for the money, or just moving up the chain.

I do understand that if senior pilots sat at the top of their banded categories, junior pilots would have an opportunity to take those higher paying spots that would be otherwise filled by those senior guys. But, it would most likely mean a commute to new aircraft delivery spots or retirement vacancies.

Might be worth it, but for those pilots waiting for a chance to move to SLC320A, ATL320A, MSP320A..ect..the wait would be longer. Didnt I just see someone pretty upset that he didnt get awarded ATL320A after 23 yrs but he could have been awarded the left seat in almost every other acft and/or base in the last 3 yrs? Because he wants ATL320A...a senior category for whatever reason...just like folks wanting SLC320A to retire in Park City and go to the Deer Valley Concert series on reserve.

Those categories will always be senior, and pay banding would make it even less likely that junior plots would be able to get to their ultimate goal.

Jmho, CG

fishforfun

Except we have about 1000 retirements per year for the next 4 years and then only slightly tapering off. If a senior guy decides to just hang out on the 764 or 330 vs going to the 777 or 350 there are still spots that open and need to be filled due to retirements. Movement is movement and there is no stopping (yet) the fact that there WILL be A positions throughout the fleet. I’m sure there is plenty of data showing the amount of training done in the last 5 years of the average career and if the company thought this would save them $1 they would be pushing for it.

MrMustache

Aren’t you in a non 320 base? I could be wrong but I suspect they are on the 73 more because your base doesn’t have the 320 vs the slightly higher pay.

Baradium

I'm in a non 320 base but I got to fly with a lot of pilots from other bases thanks to the split rotations that they did this past summer. For others that ARE in my base, 320 has come up because there is talk of a 320 base opening and there definitely were actually a lot more than I expected that at least say right now they would not bid to it because of the pay. By more than expected, I only recall a single captain saying he would bid to the 320 if we got a base. Granted my category is quite small so the sample size isn't very big, but I was still expecting more than that.

Baradium

Is this another way of saying "the impact will be reduced for the next 10 years, so who cares?" I believe that anyone who plans to still be here in 10 years should care.