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Old 10-16-2025 | 05:08 PM
  #371  
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Originally Posted by SideStickMonkey
You mean those record breaking company profits?
Yeah, pretty much. Hard for the company not to open their pocketbook when it's overflowing with cash.
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Old 10-17-2025 | 04:57 AM
  #372  
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Originally Posted by game
Dunno. But it doesn’t help our cause that so many pilots gleefully voted YES for C2019. Delta would be right to surmise that the majority of us are content with what we have in the current contract.
I think that’s a very narrow minded view, especially with how many provisions haven’t been getting followed and the fact we are having to grieve grievance settlements.
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Old 10-17-2025 | 05:25 AM
  #373  
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Originally Posted by Gone Flying
​​​​​​​

where are you getting the pay tables for pre C2000 rates?
Copies of old contracts are available by request from ALPA. Almost all old company financial reports are available online.

The investor reports have some really cool nostalgic pictures!
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Old 10-17-2025 | 05:26 AM
  #374  
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What to know about the DALPA survey:
1. Leave at least 2 hours
2. 130+ questions
3. Multiple choice / assign percentage / written input
4. Save and return worked
5. There is a progress bar

Before you do the survey, think about your answer to:
- Min acceptable rate increase, one time and year to year
- If you support pay banding
- EMPHASIZE INFLATION PROTECTION your written comments

You will be asked how you assign % negotiating capital between:
- Scope
- Compensation
- Work Rules
- Vacation/Training/Hotel/Sick
- Benefits
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Old 10-17-2025 | 05:50 AM
  #375  
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Originally Posted by Hubcapped
this ^^

my point about selfish people still stands. Yes of course we are all inherently selfish, however the people that are about to time out dont care about QOL. They want cash. Beware those.

as always there is a balance. Rates will always match the other 2, qol is the real heavy hitter (subjectively)
Those about to time out are the minority at this point. They had their chance in 2012, 2014, 2019 contracts.

Nothing against them, just pointing out the reality. QOL means more time off for the same amount of money. If you want more money, you can always pick a WS/GS/SS.

20 days off a month with Soft pay and QOL means you can pick a 1-2 day GS and get more money and still have more than 1/2 of the month off. It’s just a different approach on “Pay me more, I’ll make my QOL”.
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Old 10-17-2025 | 06:22 AM
  #376  
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Originally Posted by PilotJ3
Those about to time out are the minority at this point. They had their chance in 2012, 2014, 2019 contracts.

Nothing against them, just pointing out the reality. QOL means more time off for the same amount of money. If you want more money, you can always pick a WS/GS/SS.

20 days off a month with Soft pay and QOL means you can pick a 1-2 day GS and get more money and still have more than 1/2 of the month off. It’s just a different approach on “Pay me more, I’ll make my QOL”.
If QOL is important the most significant single change you can do would be to make training and vacations pay and credit. This was virtually 100% rejected by the bottom not top of the seniority list. When I have posted it on here it’s rejected by most.
The QOL improvements from the Chapter 11 contract through contract 2019 were in fact huge. The reserve system changes alone were simply massive. I do grant that some of that was FAR117. I remember many *****ing that the 2012 contract was all about QOL and there was not enough money.
One of the ways to attempt to measure QOL is block hours flown per pilot. During what some perceive as the Golden years Delta averaged about 40 block hours per pilot. Post bankruptcy contract changes that number reached 52 block hours per pilot. That was an astounding change and allowed Delta to operate with 20% plus fewer pilots. Post contract 2016 prior to covid we were back down to around 40.
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Old 10-17-2025 | 07:14 AM
  #377  
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Originally Posted by sailingfun
If QOL is important the most significant single change you can do would be to make training and vacations pay and credit. This was virtually 100% rejected by the bottom not top of the seniority list. When I have posted it on here it’s rejected by most.
The QOL improvements from the Chapter 11 contract through contract 2019 were in fact huge. The reserve system changes alone were simply massive. I do grant that some of that was FAR117. I remember many *****ing that the 2012 contract was all about QOL and there was not enough money.
One of the ways to attempt to measure QOL is block hours flown per pilot. During what some perceive as the Golden years Delta averaged about 40 block hours per pilot. Post bankruptcy contract changes that number reached 52 block hours per pilot. That was an astounding change and allowed Delta to operate with 20% plus fewer pilots. Post contract 2016 prior to covid we were back down to around 40.
When did we vote to reject training and vacation pay of 5:15?
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Old 10-17-2025 | 08:13 AM
  #378  
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Originally Posted by game
Dunno. But it doesn’t help our cause that so many pilots gleefully voted YES for C2019. Delta would be right to surmise that the majority of us are content with what we have in the current contract.
A lower % voted yes on c2019 than c2015. Not sure if that logic tracks.

also most of our 2022 hires and all our 2023 and later hires did not get to vote on our last contract. So the demographics are definitely different.
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Old 10-17-2025 | 08:31 AM
  #379  
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Originally Posted by CBreezy
When did we vote to reject training and vacation pay of 5:15?
Not arguing, but vacation went from 3:30 (sometimes 3:45) to 4:35. That's a 33% increase in credit time. CQ went from 4:00 to 5:00, which was 25%. Those aren't insignificant numbers. That's time that is unavailable to be assigned during PBS.

Granted, people can pile in flying around those dates after the fact, but if you don't want to do it, you don't have to. The key point is that flying stays in the trip pool during PBS, and ultimately winds up in open flying as uncovered.
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Old 10-17-2025 | 08:57 AM
  #380  
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Originally Posted by HelloNewnan
Not arguing, but vacation went from 3:30 (sometimes 3:45) to 4:35. That's a 33% increase in credit time. CQ went from 4:00 to 5:00, which was 25%. Those aren't insignificant numbers. That's time that is unavailable to be assigned during PBS.

Granted, people can pile in flying around those dates after the fact, but if you don't want to do it, you don't have to. The key point is that flying stays in the trip pool during PBS, and ultimately winds up in open flying as uncovered.

Correct. This is the time to bring it up to 5:15 everything. 5:15 for Training days and Vacations.

Those are pay raises for everyone. What some don’t understand is that QOL item means you’ll fly less for equal money = more days off for extra flying if desired = More Money at the end AT YOUR DISCRETION, not imposed by PBS.
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