MOU 25-05
02-21-2026 | 07:18 AM
#2272
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,149
Likes: 281
02-21-2026 | 07:51 AM
#2273
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 2,249
Likes: 1,103
The company can’t get to GS when there’s 140 OOBWS in with AA.
It doesn’t matter if the GS is for two days out, the math simply doesn’t work.
There’s people at 80% with slips thinking they’re going to get a 23M7 payment. No you’re not.
It’s a negotiation which we will leave for Section 6 but the current environment even with QS is not sustainable.
It doesn’t matter if the GS is for two days out, the math simply doesn’t work.
There’s people at 80% with slips thinking they’re going to get a 23M7 payment. No you’re not.
It’s a negotiation which we will leave for Section 6 but the current environment even with QS is not sustainable.
For those in categories where that isn’t the case (primarily large NB categories), QS will ensure that premium still goes out in seniority order, WHILE costing the company 300%.
Additionally, as others have already said, plenty of sub-80% pilots are getting 23M7 payments. You’re throwing that assumption out there without actually looking at the data in many categories.
This is 100% management’s problem at this point. They’ll never escape the cost of their problem, nor should we let them. Yes, it likely makes sense to shift the value elsewhere in the contact. But if management tries to get out of their problem at a discount, then status quo is perfectly fine.
02-21-2026 | 08:32 AM
#2274
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,149
Likes: 281
You’re talking about something that is highly category dependent. Plenty of categories still have G’s going out on a daily basis.
For those in categories where that isn’t the case (primarily large NB categories), QS will ensure that premium still goes out in seniority order, WHILE costing the company 300%.
Additionally, as others have already said, plenty of sub-80% pilots are getting 23M7 payments. You’re throwing that assumption out there without actually looking at the data in many categories.
This is 100% management’s problem at this point. They’ll never escape the cost of their problem, nor should we let them. Yes, it likely makes sense to shift the value elsewhere in the contact. But if management tries to get out of their problem at a discount, then status quo is perfectly fine.
For those in categories where that isn’t the case (primarily large NB categories), QS will ensure that premium still goes out in seniority order, WHILE costing the company 300%.
Additionally, as others have already said, plenty of sub-80% pilots are getting 23M7 payments. You’re throwing that assumption out there without actually looking at the data in many categories.
This is 100% management’s problem at this point. They’ll never escape the cost of their problem, nor should we let them. Yes, it likely makes sense to shift the value elsewhere in the contact. But if management tries to get out of their problem at a discount, then status quo is perfectly fine.
Generally there’s 1 GS for every 8-10 IAs.
And yes, I agree there is in fact really junior people getting 23M7 but the vast majority are going to page 1 and 2 of wide reports. Junior folk are making way much more because of IAs then 23M7 fishing. Of course that fishing in turn helps them get IAs because the whole coverage ladder is toast.
Yes, this is a management problem to fix and I’ve said over and over again it’s for Section 6. I hope we get massive gains for fixing the problem.
02-21-2026 | 08:37 AM
#2275
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2025
Posts: 962
Likes: 745
I’m looking at the 320. Our largest fleet. There’s 140+ OOBWS in over all the bases fishing for that 23M7 payment.
Generally there’s 1 GS for every 8-10 IAs.
And yes, I agree there is in fact really junior people getting 23M7 but the vast majority are going to page 1 and 2 of wide reports. Junior folk are making way much more because of IAs then 23M7 fishing. Of course that fishing in turn helps them get IAs because the whole coverage ladder is toast.
Yes, this is a management problem to fix and I’ve said over and over again it’s for Section 6. I hope we get massive gains for fixing the problem.
Generally there’s 1 GS for every 8-10 IAs.
And yes, I agree there is in fact really junior people getting 23M7 but the vast majority are going to page 1 and 2 of wide reports. Junior folk are making way much more because of IAs then 23M7 fishing. Of course that fishing in turn helps them get IAs because the whole coverage ladder is toast.
Yes, this is a management problem to fix and I’ve said over and over again it’s for Section 6. I hope we get massive gains for fixing the problem.
02-21-2026 | 08:37 AM
#2276
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 12,823
Likes: 169
From: window seat
I’m looking at the 320. Our largest fleet. There’s 140+ OOBWS in over all the bases fishing for that 23M7 payment.
Generally there’s 1 GS for every 8-10 IAs.
And yes, I agree there is in fact really junior people getting 23M7 but the vast majority are going to page 1 and 2 of wide reports. Junior folk are making way much more because of IAs then 23M7 fishing. Of course that fishing in turn helps them get IAs because the whole coverage ladder is toast.
Yes, this is a management problem to fix and I’ve said over and over again it’s for Section 6. I hope we get massive gains for fixing the problem.
Generally there’s 1 GS for every 8-10 IAs.
And yes, I agree there is in fact really junior people getting 23M7 but the vast majority are going to page 1 and 2 of wide reports. Junior folk are making way much more because of IAs then 23M7 fishing. Of course that fishing in turn helps them get IAs because the whole coverage ladder is toast.
Yes, this is a management problem to fix and I’ve said over and over again it’s for Section 6. I hope we get massive gains for fixing the problem.
No one is in any way entitled to be “made whole” for getting bypassed for 7 trips on the same day that they never could have flown more than one of because physics.
The next pilot is currently entitled to that bypass money and we need an instant fix for it.
02-21-2026 | 08:48 AM
#2277
Bent over by buybacks
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,585
Likes: 584
We are hopefully going to squeeze them for everything we can get in section 6. They should be motivated to get something done in way less than two years. But they have no reason to help us for free. we just need to wind the clock and see this through. Who would have believed we'd have this much leverage for this contract cycle?
02-21-2026 | 08:57 AM
#2278
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,436
Likes: 438
I'm all for extracting a big gain from the company in section 6 for this, but if the "status quo" continues, we'll probably have to start calling scheduling and asking them to at least run the WS step for particular trips, if we want to pickup close in trips. While some view the status quo as fine, it had degraded my QOL a quite a bit. They are getting a little better lately, but not even starting the WS step is crazy.
Last edited by crewdawg; 02-21-2026 at 09:08 AM.
02-21-2026 | 10:14 AM
#2279
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 12,823
Likes: 169
From: window seat
Why would the company agree to this outside of section 6?
We are hopefully going to squeeze them for everything we can get in section 6. They should be motivated to get something done in way less than two years. But they have no reason to help us for free. we just need to wind the clock and see this through. Who would have believed we'd have this much leverage for this contract cycle?
We are hopefully going to squeeze them for everything we can get in section 6. They should be motivated to get something done in way less than two years. But they have no reason to help us for free. we just need to wind the clock and see this through. Who would have believed we'd have this much leverage for this contract cycle?
02-21-2026 | 10:14 AM
#2280
Coverage Award...
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,708
Likes: 127
I'm all for extracting a big gain from the company in section 6 for this, but if the "status quo" continues, we'll probably have to start calling scheduling and asking them to at least run the WS step for particular trips, if we want to pickup close in trips. While some view the status quo as fine, it had degraded my QOL a quite a bit. They are getting a little better lately, but not even starting the WS step is crazy.
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