Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-02-2013 | 04:04 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 478
Likes: 0
09-02-2013 | 04:07 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,919
Likes: 0
Also, keep in mind when sitting short call you only need to be within a reasonable distance/time from one of the 3 NYC airports.
09-02-2013 | 04:16 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 584
Likes: 0
From: 330 FO
It was not cavalier at all. When people are on furlough, most of them found other jobs. They may have been at NetJets, or ASA, or working for their father's insurance company. It is cavalier to make them have to decide to quit their job when you have no clue as to whether or not they will have solid employment for more than six months. We took a shot at avoiding bankruptcy in 2004 but no one was under the impression that it was a sure thing. We knew that staffing efficiencies would allow Delta to operate with about 700 fewer pilots in 2006 than they needed in 2005. So everyone involved, the MEC, management, the administration, the negotiators tried to find the path that would provide the most assurance to all the pilots, both the ones that were recalled in 2005 and those that were yet to be recalled.
Northwest furloughed pilots twice. United furloughed pilots twice. US Airways furloughed pilots twice. TWA and Pan Am all furloughed twice. You tell me, would you want to take a recall with a 6 month guarantee of employment? Northwest went bankrupt in September 2005, the same day Delta did. They furloughed pilots in November 2005 and kept furloughing until February 2006. It was almost 200 pilots. They were still bringing back pilots from furlough in 2008, three years later. The most junior pilot furloughed had been on property for 8 months from his last furlough.
When bankruptcy hit we lost the entire 737-200 fleet. We were overstaffed by hundreds of pilots. If we had 600-700 more, what in the world would make you think they would not furlough those pilots? Seriously, are you daft?
It was not cavalier at all. What is cavalier is that we should "hope" that management would not furlough. Did you see what bankruptcy was? What in the hell would give you "hope" that management would hold on to hundreds and hundreds of extra pilots that they didn't need? So you want some pilot to quit his job that is feeding his family on some vague "hope" that everything would work out well? Are you cruel or just ignorant?
Unless you are completely insane, you would see how the most caring and kind thing you could do was not force people into making these life altering decisions with no security behind it. Everyone was quite happy that once a pilot was recalled at Delta, they had a job and they weren't just used for a few months and then tossed aside again. Yet you want these pilots to live on some vague "hope". I wonder if the Kroger's accepted "hope" when those double furloughed pilots needed to feed their kids.
Get rid of your anger and use your brain for once in your life. Or maybe you are just a cruel person that likes to play with people's lives like they are pawns.
Northwest furloughed pilots twice. United furloughed pilots twice. US Airways furloughed pilots twice. TWA and Pan Am all furloughed twice. You tell me, would you want to take a recall with a 6 month guarantee of employment? Northwest went bankrupt in September 2005, the same day Delta did. They furloughed pilots in November 2005 and kept furloughing until February 2006. It was almost 200 pilots. They were still bringing back pilots from furlough in 2008, three years later. The most junior pilot furloughed had been on property for 8 months from his last furlough.
When bankruptcy hit we lost the entire 737-200 fleet. We were overstaffed by hundreds of pilots. If we had 600-700 more, what in the world would make you think they would not furlough those pilots? Seriously, are you daft?
It was not cavalier at all. What is cavalier is that we should "hope" that management would not furlough. Did you see what bankruptcy was? What in the hell would give you "hope" that management would hold on to hundreds and hundreds of extra pilots that they didn't need? So you want some pilot to quit his job that is feeding his family on some vague "hope" that everything would work out well? Are you cruel or just ignorant?
Unless you are completely insane, you would see how the most caring and kind thing you could do was not force people into making these life altering decisions with no security behind it. Everyone was quite happy that once a pilot was recalled at Delta, they had a job and they weren't just used for a few months and then tossed aside again. Yet you want these pilots to live on some vague "hope". I wonder if the Kroger's accepted "hope" when those double furloughed pilots needed to feed their kids.
Get rid of your anger and use your brain for once in your life. Or maybe you are just a cruel person that likes to play with people's lives like they are pawns.
Good Lord, the condescension.
I'll tell you right now, alpha, they weren't handing out jobs (especially flying jobs) like candy after 9-11. I personally worked 4 different jobs during my furlough with periods of unemployment in between. One was a temporary contract and one company went tango uniform.
If a guy had a good gig and he felt things to dicey at DAL to come back right then, bypass. That's it. You act like everyone had a great job and would've been screwed if they came back. You don't have a clue what you're talking about. That's one of ALPA's main problems, an almost complete disconnect with it's membership and the feeling that "we" know what's best for you. Some had good jobs. Hundreds didn't, and would've taken a 6 month recall in a heartbeat for many different reasons.
But thanks for looking out for our best interests, whoever "we" is.
09-02-2013 | 04:42 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 784
Likes: 0
From: Still in one
Alpha,
I'm a little confused by your comments - I thought DAL Flt Ops has historically used 12-18 months as the finacial break-even furlough period when considering furloughs, in large part due to the AE training and manning sine wave vs. seasonal flying. We were overstaffed at the merger yet did not furlough due to the above (?). Neither UAL nor NWA planned for 6 month recalls and subsequent furloughs, it was a business miscalculation. I'm not that familiar with the DAL furlough history - are the longer time periods a more recent development?
I'm a little confused by your comments - I thought DAL Flt Ops has historically used 12-18 months as the finacial break-even furlough period when considering furloughs, in large part due to the AE training and manning sine wave vs. seasonal flying. We were overstaffed at the merger yet did not furlough due to the above (?). Neither UAL nor NWA planned for 6 month recalls and subsequent furloughs, it was a business miscalculation. I'm not that familiar with the DAL furlough history - are the longer time periods a more recent development?
09-02-2013 | 04:49 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 472
Likes: 0
From: Top
09-02-2013 | 05:06 AM
Straight QOL, homie
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,202
Likes: 1
From: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
09-02-2013 | 05:53 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 12,078
Likes: 15
From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
In the mood for smooth?
If you got the toast, here's some very smooth jam for Monday morning ....
Sticking with the breakfast theme, how about a little Bacon with that?
... and to finish breakfast, a fresh (well shaped like an) egg ... a tune that goes out to our friends at the DPA.
If you got the toast, here's some very smooth jam for Monday morning ....
Sticking with the breakfast theme, how about a little Bacon with that?
... and to finish breakfast, a fresh (well shaped like an) egg ... a tune that goes out to our friends at the DPA.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 09-02-2013 at 06:12 AM.
09-02-2013 | 05:59 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
You gotta laugh. ATL-CLT is a 30-35 minute flight. Blocks at 1:20-1:25 now. And you still might not be on time on a clear day.
Why? Because CLT doesn't like airplanes pointed at them or away from them, they just don't like airplanes.
Why? Because CLT doesn't like airplanes pointed at them or away from them, they just don't like airplanes.
09-02-2013 | 06:02 AM
Line Holder
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 378
Likes: 5
Just read an email from the A320 fleet to instructors. According to the letter Boeing and AB were both in town pitching deals. The company was leaning hard towards AB but very recently Boeing has sweetened its deal.
Could be why no announcement yet. I apologize for taking everyone away from the DPA vs DALPA debate.
Could be why no announcement yet. I apologize for taking everyone away from the DPA vs DALPA debate.
09-02-2013 | 06:27 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 12,078
Likes: 15
From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
