Agree. It actually does speak to a functional and (sometimes) productive relationship.

It doesn't fully explain how our MEC got in this spot, and how they got out of it.

I think a lot of what happened in the last 48 hours is worthy of review. Some very weird stuff happened. How the MEC refined this thing, time and time again, and word didn't get out (or wasn't taken seriously) about the THTTSNEBMA, is beyond me.

This should also serve as a wake-up call to the majority of pilots: if you don't participate, issues get settled in favor of the vocal minority. There is no effective democracy when the majority has a major case of the apathies. And there is no true representation, if you're not asking the right questions of the pilot group.

I don't have the stomach for investing more time on a post-action analysis right now, as the family is rioting over my participation of the last few days.

Thanks again, CE, for the info and analysis.

Agree w/ DAWGs. Need an "after action" on how that got to the MEC.

The numbers they were using at the meeting were somewhere around +$38M and +137 jobs from this TA as amended. We didn't get to see the math which was shown in closed session.

[QUOTE=Check Essential;1649546]What happened today was incredibly significant not just for the contractual gains contained in this Agreement but also for the events that occurred over the last 48 hours.

We just saw an astonishing display of the power of the Delta pilot group when everyone gets unified and puts their mind to a common goal. This happened so fast and the MEC reps and administration were so effective in pivoting and putting that unexpected "surge" to good use that it really sets a tone for the upcoming Contract 2015. I don't usually praise those guys and how we got CDOs in the first place can be dissected later, but the last two days the MEC and the negotiators performed exceedingly well.

Also-
I am loathe to admit this, but I must.
Its pretty obvious that somebody in UPPER management at Delta Air Lines did us a "solid" today. They recognized the revolt that the MEC had on its hands and I think they had to acknowledge and respond to the will of the pilot group. They had no choice if they wanted any agreement at all. That is a demonstration of the strength of our unity.

But -- management easily could have made this whole episode a lot more painful and in fact downright ugly for our Association and all of us. At another airline that is probably exactly what would have happened. Not at Delta.





Check,

I just wonder how much management really wanted CDO's in the first place? :confused: Seems like a recipe for disaster from the start - and if there ever was a Mishap involving a CDO, the lawyers would have been all over it for years.

Anyway seems like it all worked out pretty well for us - we keep the 5:15 with no CDO's. :)

Scoop

It was an unusual process of how CDO's got dumped to be sure. Definitely a good thing! I'm concerned however that they were given any consideration to begin with. It's also troubling that some on here kept trying to sell them as no big deal because "we already have fatigue induced flying, what's a little more?" That was very poor logic and smacked of "support the NC proposal at all costs". The process for deciding on something of this magnitude should follow an open and logical sequence:

1. Survey the pilots
2. Release the results and discuss
3. Create a pro/con paper that accurately fleshes out what we are really talking about. Add to that as more pilots bring their perspective to the table (The "what if's"). We have pilots here that eat, sleep and drink airlines and contracts (I'm not just talking about guys serving within ALPA) Each pilot on our seniority list brings a unique perspective helping fully illuminate potential gotchas before they become a way of life.
4. Let memory rat out of it's cage to be heard.

Following this protocol every pilot has an opportunity to study the details and weigh in with their input and vote. This level of inclusion is what truly brings "unity". Unity is no longer just words.

Now while we are patting ourselves on the back regarding the removal of CDO's (Tsquare was right...they must have had to go) has anybody nailed down the effect of added augmentation? "The company probably won't use it much if at all" just doesn't fly. Again, why not sit down with management and ask "what are the markets/routes you want them on and why?" The union takes that info to our pilot group to discuss. If the pilot group agrees with the addition of those specific augmented routes via memory rat, we codify them with management so there is never any remote chance for misunderstanding what was really being asked for.

Lastly, it seems the company has not been assigning flying until noon the first day on reserve. The recent FAA legal interpretations helped our cause. Did the company just throw the CDO thing in as a red herring? I am honestly asking. Ever been pulled over for speeding...the cop writes you up for 5 under your actual speed whereupon you thank him for giving you a ticket because he was so nice to you?

^^^^^^^^^^ This!

Scoop :)

"We didn't get to see the math."

Now there's a "shocker."

The math was based on a variable utterly unknowable to the NC: how exactly the company intended to implement CDOs.

Anyone who provided numbers based on the current trip mix--or any trip mix unless it was provided by the company--needs to be beaten severely about the head and shoulders and banned from collecting FPL ever again.

Did each rep have to go on record with a yes or no vote, or did this process happen before such vote?

Carl

The TA was approved unanimously by the MEC

It was decided to forgo "memory rat" by a vote of 11-8

Have you asked your rep how that happened?