Originally Posted by brakechatter (Post 1668435)

I don't agree. The company is chipping away at work rules with LOAs, and throwing the token money at us, which we snap up like Pavlov's dogs.

My hope when the NW pilots came on board was that we would stiffen our spines just a bit, but the contrary has happened. The results are starting to show. Schedule quality has gone downhill, schedule flexibility going downhill, rerouting out of control, no real progress made on scope recapture--because it will take care of itself. In short, we have made QOL trades for money.

Here comes C15. Company is going to want relief from their training problem, company is going to want relief from sick issues--caused by guys fling domestically 11 days in a row. They will be willing to pay $$$ for pay banding, for sick banks, other items here and there. Scope will probably remain status quo.

The key will be the timing and severity of the downturn. Will the $$$$ hold up? Will we have to give up the scope to keep a semblance of the $$$$ in 2017 or 2018? Will the pay banding and other training relief granted come back to bite us if a significant downsize occurs?

In short, since I know everyone likes to bash them so much and can relate so well, will we become USAirways of today, or worse SWA without the money AND a hub and spoke operation.

Strategic vs tactic. Discuss….

Originally Posted by Herkflyr (Post 1668463)

But we didn't get CDOs. They were foolishly tentatively agreed to (apparently with far more onerous flight times than the original PMNW guys who initially proposed the idea ever envisioned). However due to the line pilot outcry--mine one of the many voices who immediately contacted their reps--the MEC listened and we never adopted them. That was a good lesson learned, I believe.

Had the CDOs been implemented, especially without memrat, then his point would have been valid. Other than that I can't think of any negatives with the recent LOA in its final form.

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1668471)

As far as scope goes, it may actually be recapture. There is no way Delta can sustain its regionals like this. Rumor has it, Delta went to Compass to see if they could take on additional flying, Compass said no, then signs with AA. I wouldn't be surprised if XJT/ASA walks away too after Delta tries to reset their rates. At Endeavor, the resignations have gone up since the EtD, and no one is qualified to pass the Delta interview right out of college. So if Delta wants to fly its 76 seat jets, then they will be at mainline. The other airlines are willing to pay a premium to get what's left of the regionals.

Also, I sold all the Delta stock I had today, we are canceling flights here, and while the sky is not falling by any means, canceled flights lead to earning's misses, and that's never good.

Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 1668376)

... And what were the actual profits during 117 negotiations? Yet somehow, DALPA found a way to give concessions for an item neither we nor they wanted!?

What are your thoughts on the most recent attempt at "constructive engagement" as it applies to the SAN hotel?

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 1668413)

Which was exactly the reason why Richard wanted to open early and get it done quickly...:rolleyes:

Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 1668506)

It's also why DALPA insisted on a 3 year deal.

Originally Posted by iceman49 (Post 1668459)

5 weeks ago RA said no used wide bodies, but never say never in this industry.

Originally Posted by maddogmax (Post 1668464)

Can I assume you are talking about airplanes not new hire FA's

Originally Posted by brakechatter (Post 1668435)

I don't agree. The company is chipping away at work rules with LOAs, and throwing the token money at us, which we snap up like Pavlov's dogs.

My hope when the NW pilots came on board was that we would stiffen our spines just a bit, but the contrary has happened. The results are starting to show. Schedule quality has gone downhill, schedule flexibility going downhill, rerouting out of control, no real progress made on scope recapture--because it will take care of itself. In short, we have made QOL trades for money.

Here comes C15. Company is going to want relief from their training problem, company is going to want relief from sick issues--caused by guys fling domestically 11 days in a row. They will be willing to pay $$$ for pay banding, for sick banks, other items here and there. Scope will probably remain status quo.

The key will be the timing and severity of the downturn. Will the $$$$ hold up? Will we have to give up the scope to keep a semblance of the $$$$ in 2017 or 2018? Will the pay banding and other training relief granted come back to bite us if a significant downsize occurs?

In short, since I know everyone likes to bash them so much and can relate so well, will we become USAirways of today, or worse SWA without the money AND a hub and spoke operation.

Strategic vs tactic. Discuss….

Originally Posted by forgot to bid (Post 1668510)

That brings up a question. I can see what the incentives for the company was to get C2012 done early.

But what incentives do they have to get C2015 done early? Could we end up living with C2012 for a while?

Just curious.