Airline Pilot Central Forums - Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

It seems my fellow APCer's think this is a thought provoking or thought challenging post. I think it is a thoughtless post or at best an empty bravado post. The generation you mentioned had to deal with; de-regulation, oil increasing 300%, bankruptcy, 3 mergers, MoRon , Mullins Carpetbaggers, 2 wars, an airline friendly congress and a labor friendly NLRB ( last 2 TIC ).
It is easy in hindsight to say this or that should or shouldn't have been done. Lee at Gettysburg, Vietnam, history is full of examples of there is always a better way.
When I was hired reserve was 24/7 short call, no rest, no long call when you were on reserve you were on short call period. No trip trading, no swap with the pot, your schedule was your schedule. There are so many other improvements in QOL that are too numerous to mention that happened under "the senior guys".
Give credit where credit is due. One other point, when Delta does good we as pilots do good, when Delta does bad it doesn't matter what is in our contract or how bad ass we are 'cause we are going to get our a$$es kicked, end of story.
I hope in 20 years when I'm senile ( more senile ) I can look in and judge your generation as being better than ours but you will have many major battles to fight and I truly hope you succeed.

There were two missteps in my mind that ALPA and the other unions had a part in:
1. Pre-bankruptcy concessions
2. Permitted flying operated as Alter Ego flying

Both of these are things, the union's legal departments knew what the result would be, and they did it anyway.

finis72

07-07-2014 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1679237)

I agree with number 2, in hindsight. I disagree with 1, bankruptcy can be a real crapshoot and we watched 4 major airlines go into and never come out ( Braniff, Eastern, Pan Am and TWA )

Gnewt

07-07-2014 01:56 PM

Hey all,

Quick diversion from the gun fight here. Anyone know where I can get the direct phone numbers for layover hotels? The only one I can find sends you to the central reservations number. PM me if you have security concerns.

Thanks......G

Sink r8

07-07-2014 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finis72 (Post 1679093)

What made NERD's post interesting to me was turning the conversation to a different topic: the next generation.

I don't think it's important to indict or congratulate the current generation, or award "good" and "bad" labels to individuals that participated. Instead, I think it's time to talk about what we're going to do next.

finis72

07-07-2014 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 1679259)

I think it's always better to look forward, yesterday is just that, yesterday.

Sink r8

07-07-2014 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1679044)

What I would like to see is more mentoring, more of D-ALPA's subject matter experts assigning tasks, under supervision, to their bench. Training these guys up with the lessons learned and the relationships needed to get the pilots' work done.

That makes sense. I agree completely that the bench should be deeper. I'd like to see term limits as a device to ensure new blood is required, and cycled through.

As for your point about regional guys coming up, I hope they don't get so wrapped-up around the relationship between mainline and regionals, that they lose track of the forest and the trees.

I tend to think the regional model is broken, and pilot recruitment issues will only accelerate the inevitable end. I suspect that flying will continue to migrate home naturally, and I would be nervous about guys trying to purchase it. When it gets to the point where management recognizes it, and shrinks the outsourced portion on their own, and doesn't even use the allotted 50-seaters, then we can negotiate to lock in the new numbers.

I'm OK with the Scope trade in C2012, but it's now more and more obvious that up-gaging, and transferring flying to mainline, is a logical process, driven by economics. Let's be patient, not yield anything on the RJ side, and focus on the large-gauge end of the outsourcing spectrum.

Bucking Bar

07-07-2014 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gnewt (Post 1679258)

Crew Tracking

800 DAL CREW

Ferd149

07-07-2014 02:39 PM

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Originally Posted by gzsg (Post 1679212)

Nerd

I.admire your passion. While the MEC is very junior and you are.well.represented, the power lies with insiders who have been around for a.long time. These insiders do management's bidding.

If you want to restore our profession and your future, focus on protecting profit.sharing and preventing pay banding.

Our concessions are no longer necessary. Why would we grant more?

This contract is make or break. Get your group active. We have a good MEC except for Randy and Buzz. Contact them often. They will listen.

I mostly agree except for the bold part.

I've said probably a dozen times on here that profit sharing is a scam to make you feel "like part of the organization". Give me dollars that can't be manipulated by the accountants, either in direct compensation or work rules. For the life of me, I don't know how we ever got on this profit sharing bandwagon?:confused::mad:

Ferd

Bucking Bar

07-07-2014 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 1679269)

I hope they don't get so wrapped-up around the relationship between mainline and regionals, that they lose track of the forest and the trees.

Ask a B Scale guy how he felt about B Scale. It is a similar political dynamic.

Bucking Bar

07-07-2014 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1679237)

I would narrow that down to the concept of selling jobs for pay. A union owes all of it's members the same representational obligation. It is immoral to use the loss of one pilot's unemployment to give another pilot a pay subsidy.

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