We are navtech as well. A change to that would create a complete change to the bid process and policy (with flight ops changes as well- FO's do special quals as well which is LCA type rules).

You can call your reps or just wait for the TA to come out and read it yourself..

What we have now is better than that because you can CHOOSE to pick up flying after your trip is removed. It pays on top of the trip that they paid and dropped.

Nope. No all nighters.
















Until after c2015 and CDOs come in.

Could OE trips be built separate from the general bid packet that will only be awarded to FO's up for OE, then put in open time if there is not an FO/CA upgrade that lines up with that trip? I would think there are some airports that we would want our new pilots to see early and the appropriate number of hours/landings.

With a steady flow of hiring, I would think the number of OE's per fleet/month is fairly predictable to about a 90% solution.

When 23 G5 was fixed as I recall, there were several quids that were included like the one year seat lock for new hires, the ability for OE planners to pull trips from open time etc. in theory, this provision has already been "paid for". Now we are talking about possibly abrogating seniority for FO's and some suggestions even are doing the same for LCAs?

I certainly wouldn't say that there isn't some sort of middle ground in this issue (I have learned to never say never) but recovery flying for FO's or screwing with the bidding process in a way that screws seniority, should be a no go....

I just don't understand why we're working this hard to solve the company's problem--and to our own QOL detriment!

Stop the presses. I completely agree.

Much as I enjoy reading this board at times, sometimes I shake my head. This entire mini-discussion stemmed from a post asking about current OE rules. How it dovetailed into all sorts of hypothetical changes to the contract perplexes me.

Ignore rumors, stay in touch with your reps, and all that...

I agree with Ron, Pd, and Herk. We have a management trial balloon floating before us, and it's an unattractive one at that. Maybe RA said something to a LCA about FO's "sitting home", maybe he didn't. So what? If he starts musing about perdiem, or credit time, or having a seniority-based system, do we try to figure out how to cough those things up?

The only motivations I've identified so far in arguing for modifications to the OE/OE removal system are greed, jealousy, Stockholm Syndrome, or ignorance:

1) I want something else (like a paid APD), so screw "those guys",
2) "Those guys" get a good deal, so screw them,
3) Well, I guess that if you really want to screw those guys, I should help?
4) Oops! I didn't realize that "those guys" actually means me!

Let's focus on things that improve our common lot.

I did exactly this yesterday. Everyone else should too! Squeaky wheel and all that.