I'd think you'd have to do whatever TSA asks. Put a person in it, put GPS tracking on it, auto reporting if a window or door opens, etc.

ACL is right, people in the know might not buy so we must make it near seamless and headache free as possible. For anyone who has taken the bus or cab between the two knows the routes are very odd depending on the time of day.

I couldn't disagree more. King did something that I've never seen on these boards. He tried to stop a debate by saying "management knows who all you guys are...and you are about to learn a painful lesson that you'll never forget, etc." Complete threatening BS, but it sure has worked for the folks on this thread.

So there it is, the answer to the question that I've asked twice, which was: is there EVER a time where the majority of DAL pilots would use a self help weapon against their own management team? The answer is not only a resounding no, but apparently all it takes is a few posts from an anonymous internet character to stop any debate on the subject.

So I wish you all the best folks. Continue to discuss whether management will buy more airplanes, or hire more pilots. But most importantly, pray that management is always nice to us. Because in my opinion, this pilot group does not have the will to fight management if that's what it comes to.

Maybe I'm just too old and have fought too many battles against management, but it seems to me that our current crop of leaders have a profound fear of fighting. They simply cannot accept the possibility of a negative consequence. But they can't outwardly discuss how afraid they are to fight, so they develop terms like: "a cooperative relationship with management." That sounds so much better than the real truth. Only time will tell whether this experiment will work. My opinion - no way.

Best to all,

Carl

Yeah... we should have to pay for that. It's not like the government is here to provide for the security of the industry or anything like that... Sorry, whenever I think about the TSA, I have a hard tme thinking of a more bloated... well you know...

Or, maybe he knew that Minneapolis didn't have a summer. :D

My question of if management can do anything without going thru the union first has gone unanswered. Anyone?

Yeah, I think you are spot on. I wasn't really just referring to the airline industry either. You just don't see as many clever logos as you did in year's past. International Harvester was one that I always liked. But I actually thought the Northwest logo that combined the arrow and the big W was really clean and nicely done. I never did like the way the old "classic" widget was forced on the tails of the DAL airplanes, but that's just me. FedEx has the arrow on theirs.. I think the moniker "THE lowfare airline" is positively genius.. even though it isn't true, I'll betcha they get tons of people overpaying for flights when they could have done better elsewhere.

Wow Carl. You sure know how to stop a thread. :D

A FASCINATING article/opinion piece on the DAL/AMR fight for JAL here:

Swelblog / Swelbar on Airlines - Articles - A Battle for JAL or the Threat ofCompetition?


Highly recommended. It's so good, I almost put this link up on the main page as a new thread, but the DAL pilot footprint is already out of control on APC.

Short summary: Delta wins, no matter what happens.

I'm going to change my original post...

Carl, good points.

but the sick conversation probably needed to be done in an alpa forum. There is an issue with divulging too much or putting an internal conversation (as someone said) at Chick-fil-A instead of the crewroom or cockpit. We're making sausage in public. I think it has been pointed out the thread is monitored. So is airliners.net. Evidently insider information about network was being poured out on that forum from an employee (I think it was an employee) and that was very frustrating and enraging for Delta. Delta investigated.

But you are right, we have to pray that we always have good management. Right now I think we do, but to think over 35 years we will would be laughable. Nobody stays on top for that long and the only people here for the long term are the employees and we always need to make sure we protect our airline and therefore ourselves.

Now, if you leave this thread Carl, we all loose. Lose. We all lose. We need your insight as much as we need ACL, Slow or Supers hot Texas coed pictures. It all works together.

WOOHOO!!!!!!!:D That being said, I don't want in to come at the expense of some where else but that is probably inevitable.

Denny