Originally Posted by Ragtop Day (Post 985407)

I don't post here much, but I do keep up with the threads and this latest round of discussion has brought to light an issue that I think the ALPA structure needs to understand. I don't really care if we have the #1 ranked payrate or the #50 ranked payrate. I can look at my paystub every two weeks and figure out that it is not near enough. I can also look at my timecard and figure out that I worked too many days for that money.

I, as well as the people I fly with, are ready to see some MAJOR improvements to our total compensation package, scope and work rules. While I do not want to go as far to say that ALPA will not aggressively fight for restoration, I will say that I am concerned. The official communications from our MEC does not give me confidence. I want my union to state unequivocally that they expect our next contract to compensate us in a way that is comparable to the value of our profession before bankruptcy. I want to know that ALPA thinks that all Delta passengers should be flown by Delta pilots. I want to know that ALPA thinks that some aspects of our scheduling section need solid improvements.

Instead I get an impression that in 2012 ALPA will be content with a slightly revised version of our current agreement with a small pay increase tossed in (much like the JCBA). While this may not be correct, it is the impression that is rampent among the line pilots. If it is not the case, DALPA needs to seriously revise the content and methods of their communications. While I don't think that we need to rise to the level of militant and confrontational tactics with management, the union can say that we expect more--much more. I want the DALPA MEC to state that and I want DALPA MEC to continually state that.

When the next TA is presented to the membership, I will first look at section 1. If it does not show tightened language and improvements--No vote. I will then look at payrates/compenstation. If the package will not result in compensation of SWA/FDX/UPS+ (for an average month, not scenarios that require green/white/yellow slipping, etc.)--No vote. Third I will look at scheduling. Without major improvements--No vote. If the TA passes those three tests I will then look over the other sections and determine if it is acceptable. When the company sits across the table to exchange openers, I want them to know that we have 12,000 pilots that will vote this way and a union that will not present them with anything less.

I hope that AA/UCAL can get the improvements they want, but I do not want them to be a barometer of what we can gain. I want DALPA to respond to OUR needs. If they succeed it will make our fight easier, but it is looking increasingly more likely they both may still be unresolved by the time we open. I want DALPA to have a solid plan to restore our contract independent of what other groups are doing. In addition, if we settle for less we undercut their ability to get substantial gains.

If it sounds like I am afraid, thats because I am. I am afraid that the union I employ to protect my interests will try to sell us a contract for less than I am worth. I am afraid that my union will continue to allow more of our flying to be outsourced. All of this in the name of good relations with the company. There is a fine line the union must balance between "constructive engagement" and old fashioned union screaming and stomping. Right now ALPA seems to have too much engagement and not enough noise being made over issues that are important to us. The pilots feel disenfranchised because we have not seen any major improvements and ALPA seems content to continue down this path. I know someone will point out LOA 19 and the JCBA as improvements and my answer is that is not nearly enough. When our buying power and quality of life is back to where it was a decade ago--that will be enough.

Sorry about the rant, but we as a pilot group need to be sure that the union we hire to represent us measures gains by the assigning an acceptable value to our profession, not merely by our ranking within our peers. Slowplay, I do not mean to single out your post, it just seems that we are becoming focused on the wrong issues. I do value your opinion and am glad that we have people on this board to represent all sides of the issues. Lets figure out how to combine this energy and provide the best results possible for this pilot group.

Originally Posted by PropNWA (Post 985371)

Even if you don't get MSP initially, you would likely be able to bid into MSP within 6 months to a year if things remain as they currently stand. Hope that helps.

Originally Posted by Ragtop Day (Post 985407)

When the next TA is presented to the membership, I will first look at section 1. If it does not show tightened language and improvements--No vote. I will then look at payrates/compenstation. If the package will not result in compensation of SWA/FDX/UPS+ (for an average month, not scenarios that require green/white/yellow slipping, etc.)--No vote. Third I will look at scheduling. Without major improvements--No vote. If the TA passes those three tests I will then look over the other sections and determine if it is acceptable. When the company sits across the table to exchange openers, I want them to know that we have 12,000 pilots that will vote this way and a union that will not present them with anything less.

Originally Posted by satchip (Post 985436)

Good post but everyone is jumping on the fact that our MEC is not trumpeting from the mountain tops what we want/will accept on the next contract. Openers are even exchanged for how long? Personally, I don't want our NC to box themselves in by negotiating in public long before it's time to go to the table. Negotiating for Dummies, page 3.

Let's keep the pitchforks sharp but in the barn for now. Heck, they haven't even started the contract polling yet. We all have hot button issues and numbers in mind. Communicate those to your reps. Answer the poll when it comes. When we exchange openers, you may want to get out the pitchforks. Until then I plan to remain vigilant and communicate.

Originally Posted by Nosmo King (Post 985394)

For any geeks interested, the Nook Color update was released today for manual
Download and will be auto updating next week. Its an upgrade to Android 2.2 with
Flash and a limited app store.

Works on Deltanet - yes, zo far
Works on travelner - yes, but havent tried listing
Works on iCrew - No gets simple accelerator error in the usual places
Works on APC forums - yes

Posted from my Nook Color

Originally Posted by hoserpilot (Post 985459)

Ragtop for President!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler (Post 985376)

In YOUR seat math discussion you fail to mention the following:

Southwest $210 per hour, divided by 137 seats per aircraft = 1.53 per seat per hour.

That "seat math" yields the following for the 747: 1.53 per seat per hour X 403 seats per aircraft = $616.59 per hour.

I know, I know, Southwest is not one of our peers we can compare to. :rolleyes:

Carl